[shahar2k]

I'm sorry, I really am, I was one of the biggest advocates of keeping the forum in one piece, I loved the atmosphere, post a picture get a nice set of replies, hang out, talk about things, get time to thuroughly check out everyone's post.
Lately it's just gotten out of hand!

I can't spend more time on this forum than I do on sleep, it's just insane, something has to be done to curb the rate of posts. I'm sure everyone here feels the same.

here are some Ideas I have about fixing this:
Rework the forum, require at least one image per post, and require people to use a post more than once per image (if you fixed up a picture try and find the old post, and bring it back to life)

rethink the whole damn concept, does an open forum work as well for a sociaty of hundreds of artists as it did for tens of artists? maybe give each person a Gallery, and have updates per person, not per post (if spooge posts a new one, his name is on top, not a whole new post)
it's just an example of a new way to think about a forum, cus this is not what a message board was originally meant for,
it was meant for text, with each topic being used and reused, and not 5-7 replies per post and then let it fall to the 2nd page abysss...

I dunno, I just can't affoard to read all these posts it's just digging into my school and my life, and frankly I don't get as much out of it (pictures are repeating, drawclub stuff is posted in three diffrent posts, and reworked images do not deserve their own private show.)

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that's just my oppinion I might be wrong.

[Isric]

I agree on a few of these.
But I think that before this becomes another bitching party, maybe Dhab should do the same thing as with the 3d topic.
I definitaly don't have enough patience to check everything, so those unrecognizable names go ignored "What? Cool new Spooge stuff..off to work!"
Something has to be done, so lets do it, and not talk about it. A number of options, then we vote.

[TheMilkMan]

I think the real issue here is that like me not many artists want to look at and answer all the newbie questions and look at art we don't feel as standerd..so is the answer have a newbie section..if so how do you rate who is a newbie...

Maybe there should be a show off section and a Q&A section...I don't know..polycount has a place for questions and a place for showing stuff off...maybe we need that..I personally don't think there are that many posts...maybe it is because I use either a
t-1 or cable modem and I can go through them quickly..I really don't see the problem..

[Liquid!]

Ditto guys. I apologize to anyone whose work I missed due to the huge bandwidth of one single forum. But I don't think its humanly possible to keep up with it AND have a job..

-c

[shahar2k]

milkman, I have a DSL, and it's faster than the shared T-1 at school , and frankly speed ain't the problem, it's just that when you do things OTHER than check posts here, you get a whole page for each day you miss and that's just NEW ones

as for a newbie section I suggested that before, but took it back, it's a bad Idea, better Idea is polycount's product pimpage and Q and A sections, but even then,

I think that now, that I can't keep up with the posts here, I've found a great use for the Random musings forum (I'm a philosophy
geek)


ok, let's gather up Ideas, <----------

Please post solutions for a Vote on whether, how to, and how many times, should we split the forum?


*/

[jHof]

I belive you would have to write a new forum in ASP or HTML whatever is used for it. I'm not sure if Dhabih has time for that kind of reworking.

Don't get me wrong, I'm as scared to post as the next newbie. Cuse inside we feel we don't count since we weren't hear "From the begining". And I feel I'm cluttering up space when I post an image now-a-days.

But life goes on... If Dhabih doesn't feel its needed, then it might get flooded. Then people will leave due to the flooding of new people. Taking some Forum Vets with them. When the forum vets leave, newbies will think this place sucks and leave. But, I do belive dhabih started using this forum so he could post images to hear what others have to say. And I don't think he's gona just up and change his sight(New domain and what-not.) Maybe he will, got me.

All in all, life goes one. Go with the flow is what I say. I know I'm personally just gona stick with only posting art work I feel is finished and get feed back during that time. So I won't be posting images to clutter up space. But I do like to read everyones views on other works done here. If a forum Vet leaves, someone will soon fill his shoes and the newbies(Including myself will luck up to that person.)

Or maybe a forum Vet will start another forum to spread things out. But intime both will fill.

I say the new system should be. Only read the posts you wana read. WHOA! How about that. Stick with the names you know you like to look for. Then when you have time, check out someone else. I don't know. If the forum get shut down tomorrow, it's not the end of the world. There still gona be millions of artists out there trying to help each other out.

Again, I do feel crappy about being new here and posting images. But I would still like things to just move along and I belive they can. I think this is just a concern to people who think they have found a gold mine and don't wana tell anyone about it, in hopes for their own greedy personal gain. But ahwell... Friends don't let bubbys drink drunk.

Snarf!

[edit]Oh and if your having a hard time getting away from the forum, cuse you feel obligated for some reason to read everything. I belive thats a self-control issue, there are plenty of forums out there for helping you out with that type of thought pattern.

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This is what an HTML link looks like without the proper tags.
Speeling is THE most important thing to me, next to art.

I cleverly figured out how to add a 5th line to my signature file by

[This message has been edited by jHof (edited November 14, 2000).]

[waylon]

I think separating "art/hardware related questions" from "image critiques" might be a good idea.

The only problem with this, at first glance, is that less people will read the art questions section. But that might be more of a blessing than a burden, since it would encourage people with horribly inane questions to not post in the first place. And as long as people stick with decent topic names, the more important questions will hopefully get enough replies.

Someone suggested making separate threads for traditional and digital art. This might not be a bad idea either. The "traditional" thread might not get read as much, since I'm sure that's where all the 5-minute pencil sketches would end up, but that kind of goes hand in hand with my previous argument.

As far as pulling out other categories... I don't think anything else would work as well as separating out either art discussion or traditional art.

Starting a separate 3D forum won't reduce the number of posts here significantly, though I suppose it does have potential for starting a nice 3D community.

Separating out "quick" sketches from more "serious" paintings has one major problem: nobody will want to look at the quick sketch thread (since the art won't be nearly as nice), so no one will end up posting there.

Making a gallery show-off section might not work very well, since nearly every image posted here is accompanied by at least a request for critique, if not a number of specific questions. The line between this section and the "normal" digital art section would be very blurry.

There have also been a number of suggestions which would require heavy moderation, like requiring each post to have an image in it. Anything that requires moderation probably isn't feasable, due to the fact that we'd need some very dedicated moderators who wouldn't mind getting flamed for deleting or closing threads.

I agree that it would be good to have a vote on this, but it's all up to Dhabib.

[waylon]

jHof: Nobody, NOBODY should feel like they can't post images for fear of cluttering up the forum. As long as you've put some serious effort into a picture, there are literally hundreds of people on here who'll be happy to look at it, and maybe even five or ten who'll give you some useful advice. It's always a pleasure to see art that someone has put some thought and effort into, no matter what their skill level.

[Solitaire]

I am aware of these problems, but setting up a "ghetto" for newbies and create a class system is not the intention of the board.
I experienced this place as a gathering point, where to get answers and help. Well if some profs don't care about novices' skills I can't help it, but some do.....(At least that's what I hope for)

[shahar2k]

I know, no newbie segregation (cus then where you draw the line?)
I think the Idea with Isric's one post for all your pictures is great, so all newbies start a thread with their name and gallery, and just post ALL their images no matter how old there (I just wish the page system didn't carry through to individual posts)

some sort of cascading organization could be made?
I haven't got a concrete plan...

_____________________________
How about more Ideas people? what WOULD you do with the forum? we could vote later, and make the process easier for dhab
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[Conor O Kane]

I've recently designed a new site for an artist friend of mine. Her site is at www.blackscarab.com and contains a forum for general discussion of all art. Anyone interested in discussing art feel free to use that forum, whereas those more interested in posting work and critiquing other's work can continue to use this forum.

It's just a suggestion - I'm trying to get more regulars over on Blackscarab so anyone's welcome. We'd particularly like anyone with experience in digital art creation, as Corinne's work is mostly traditional at the moment.

[Frost]

...about the personal gallery thin; I did that ("frost's thread-o-crap(tm)") and it just gets messy after a while. It's nice that I have one thread for my own images to crit, but after 4 months or so, you end up having 20 posts with images and 100 posts with comments, so if you add a new one, you have to go to the last page and read thru endless posts.

I like the idea of having one thread for one person's work in that it limits the overall number of threads. Some people start 2 threads a day, while people like me (even though I generally post a lot of replies) start 15 threads or less during an entire year.

I think people should know that some of us are getting overwhelmed with the number of threads to follow, and that they should keep new thread creation to a minimum, not a new thread for pic update for example. Personally, it's been a few weeks where I just rapidly read through 1/8 of the threads here because there are just WAY too many.

I guess that's what you get when you have so many members... which, brings us back to an idea Loki had about tutoring... when an experienced artist could take under his/her wing a few young and willing artists and help them with their work instead of having them post new threads over and over asking for help. This of course is just an idea.

[Muzman]

This again. I don't think it's as big a problem as all that, but it is interesting to hear people's slant on things.
The split thing is dodgy, firstly because I think there's nowhere to split it. There's no way to categorise things that creates enough content for a separate forum, not that I can see. Taking out the tech questions or the art philosophy threads or the 3d or the rework threads or all of them and will barely make a dent in the new thread count (which is the factor that each individual thread is fighting for survival against). The second thing is the adding of more posting rules generally just creates more finger wagging about them being broken. There's enough vigilantes now coshing people for posting potentially 'random musings' topics. I suppose it could be said this is from folks concerned about the 'signal to noise ratio' and helping the genuine art threads avoid being tossed into the void.
It seems to me like that's the issue here. The forum shouldn't be fighting aginst it's own apparent nature all the time. I don't have any particular suggestions, except that people's gripes should be aired and discussed first rather than them just getting shitty and leaving. Folks thinking that they can't say things or post their work is not good.

[dreddawg]

I don't really have any comments about a fix for the forum. However, it dawns on me that this site is amazing. Imagine; one site/forum with hundreds (thousands?) of digital artists. All of them from every corner of the world talking about...art. Dhabih, it's your call. Growth is painful but it's the next best thing to anarchy:-) Rembrandt and Micheangelo must be jumping for joy:-)

[surferboi]

well i think dhabih could have a icon for threads with images, that way for ppl like shark who would rather see what ppl have to show n not what they have to say thatd make it easier for him to sift through the threads. personally i like it the way it is. i got 2 jobs n i goto school so i dont see everything but i do try to and am selective with the time i spend on here.

[Bradford]

Sorry I double posted this by accident, please read below.

[This message has been edited by Bradford (edited November 15, 2000).]

[Bradford]

I think by providing a specific forum for posting pictures would be nice, and then have another forum everything else, since posting pictures here is a BIG part of the reason many people visit. As well as a gathering point for questions and answers among fellow artists.

Everyone might want to check out this site, www.elfwood.com , it's a HUGE community of artist, structured differently than here, they all have there own personal galleries.

[-- Transcendent --]

I've been to elfwood, and I dislike it very much ... all you ever get there are compliments. If anyone wanted an ego boost, I'd rather have a random compiment generator. Thank goodness the people here are honest

Anyway, moving on, there are pitfalls in everyone having their own threads ... it causes unecessary lack of attention to one's pictures. Everyone would be rushing off to spooge's thread, for example, and the inverse would happen in less popular artists.

Secondly, it would be impossible to determine if a new post was a new picture or simply a comment, so that, though, would decrease the number of threads in the forum, would cause a lot of unecessary thread reading.

Third, threads might become insanely long, and people will not bother to browse through them for picture.

Though, I'm with 2k. Some changes need to be made ... if this "personal gallery" was to be implemented, I think some changes would have to be done to the root of this forum's coding.

On a completely different note, this may sound totally absurd, but splitting this forum into "q&a" and "gallery" is in fact a very good suggestion. And pehaps it could branch out into even more different forums ... I have realized that some people are beginning to post their "traditional" art works, maybe a forum solely for traditional art might improve things a little ?

[Lukias]

What about next to the post (where the folder/page icon's are) you have there something which indicates whether its text, pic, colour or b/w, 2D/3D or question/query. This way your not gonna enter the post having a fair idea of what lies inside.

me 2cents

[micke]

Bah! Leave it as it is.
Just use your common sense before posting.
My opinion.
What is bugging me is that if your'e away for 1 day, you miss several interresting posts that just disapears.

Mikael

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-Mikael Noguchi-

Mikael's artwork

[Spectra]

This have some interesting points and I agree with a few of them. But this one has no sens: "You must post 1 image to be eable to post a message."
Why it has no sens? Its because sometime you just have a question and dont want to post anything. If we must post an Image people will start to post any crappy image(or even one that has nothing to do with the topic)in order to post their question...

Maybe separate channel/forum for technical stuff, image (and so on..) would be the solution? dont know.

-Spectra

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You learn and get better at each draw you do. So persevere and one day you will draw like dhabih.

[This message has been edited by Spectra (edited November 15, 2000).]

[Jezebel]

What about just making the number of posts on the first page longer? That way they don't disappear into the second page so quickly.

-Beth

[Dhabih]

immi does a cool forums roundup at http://www.3dpalette.org which i find helpful

i dunno if thats a weekly thing or not since i've only seen it once...but that helps me

[shahar2k]

well yah those are helpfull, but who would do it here? I still think that people should just post less, and try to reuse their posts as much as possible.