[kos.mandis]

And to more great artists I just keep forgetting (sorry)...
I had started this some time ago, but I had some other things going and dropped it for a while... As you can see lately I'm going for a more paintely approach (now that's original )

Can you point out things to change and look out?


Thank you

[ex]

Im not one of the "great artists" but i still have an opinion.
One thing that pops out is the girl's arm's being too skinny.
Diet?
But I just wanted to tell you i like your coloring style and to keep up the good work.

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-- Sean FitzGerald (ex)

[Frost]

Hi kos.

Nice cartoony/caricature look!

The girl looks great, nice colors in her skin, especially the face - very nice! Her lower left leg seems broken as it is not straight. Also, if she is suppose to be sitting on 'Tank-Jr's shoulder, you should probably bring her right leg up a lot because now it seems to intersect the volume of his shoulder and doesn't give her support.

'Sarge's tones are very dirty on the other hand - the dark 'grey' really doesn't cut it - why not try getting the same tones as in the girl's? His arms and weapon are very sketchy and I can't really make out much at this stage -- perhaps getting some definite lines down would give us a better idea.

'Tank-Jr' is very early in development in your pic, so it's hard to comment, but the shapes look rather correct -- I'm not too fond on the head and jaw, too cartoony looking because of the shading.

It looks like you based yourself on another image for the girl's face which turned out great -- try adapting this type of shading to the others, and try to keep the light sources consistent in your shading.

Don't over contrast because that really distracts the eye, and when everything in a pic is overly saturated and over contrasted evenly, it really confuses the viewer and he/she has problems reading what is in front, in back, important, etc. Lighting is very important, and subtleties count for a lot.

Anyway, hope this helped out a little! Good luck!

frost.

[This message has been edited by Frost (edited June 18, 2000).]

[vebjorn]

I`m not going to go into the details of composition and anatomy on this one, but give you a good technical hint that applies to both painting in reallife and digital with opaque paints. Unless youre going for a watercolor look, I sugggest finding a base hue or hues for youre image to workform. Sample. Use photoshops hue/saturation , colorize mode and darken the image to a darkbrown, or red, blue whatever midtone that suits the mood you`re after and then apply the darker and lighter colors. Makes thing look less transparent. Like an underpainting when using oils. Also flipping the image or using a mirror kan help to get a fresh look at things and you`ll see imbalance and wrong anatomy etc. just a few helpers;-)

-Veb

[Tinusch]

The girl looks good so far. Anatomically, she could use some work, specifically in the legs, but the sahding you have so far looks great. One thing I've noticed about almost all of your pics, though - At least one of the characters always have one hand halfway raised for no reason... Heh, just an observation, it kind of makes it look unrealistic. Nice job so far, though. If you're planning on shading the rest of the picture similar to the way you shaded the girl's head and chest, then I can tell it's going to look awesome when it's done.

[Francis]

Hi kos -

Try to lay out your basic shapes before going into too much detail. The basic shapes of the figures and their composition are actually just as important (if not more) as the details.

The figures are fairly dynamic, but I think you can go a little further. I'm not going to talk about the anatomy - someone more qualified here ought to do that.

Anyway, in my sketch, you can see that I've exaggerated a couple of things, like the size of the guy's hand in the foreground. I'm trying to get more of a feeling of "in your face," where you are really close to the figures and so there is a lot more foreshortening/perspective to the figures. I wasn't sure if the woman is supposed to be floating or jumping into the foreground. I chose "jumping" and made her pose more emphasized as well, and exaggerated the perspective of her weapon to increase the sense of her "jumping into the scene."

ALso, I desaturated your colors a little bit. This is more of a subjective taste thing, but I personally don't think it's necessary to have a whole lot of bright colors to make a drawing exciting. You can use a pretty limited color palette and get your high contrast from light and shadow, which I started to indicate in my drawing. By picking a definite light source (you should try for a more definite one than mine - it's sort of off to the left somewhere, but the more defined, the better), you can again increase the sense of depth in your image.

Oh yeah, and a background would be nice.

Hope that helps.



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TeamGT Studios

[zapman]

Hi Kos,
*blink* at Francis reply =)
In Francis sketch, he made the hands bigger; giving it the Cartoon look you were going for, Gives it more depth & action to the image. Look at your image and Fancis layout. What is missing in your image? ACATION; right? All the character looks, as they are Posing for a photo. In Fanis image, no photo posing is there. Love the Robot. Right side guy is off quake? =) Shading on Girls face is excellent.
Not sure if you want the Robot Reaching out with his hand to the viewers too? Giving it over-depth? Not sure on this one.
Good luck!
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ZAPmAn
Digitize Design
art, fart, and be smart.

[This message has been edited by zapman (edited June 18, 2000).]

[psi burn]

im a major quake3 player so ill put a little input on this one...

image is a little funky....youve got way too many different styles/looks in there and they dont really work. tank jr's face looks great but it doesnt fit in anywhere with the girl's detail or design. also, the girls hands are extremely manly and big and dont look right. her boobs may just be a bit TOO big (did i just say that?) and whats she doing with her left hand? looks like shes single-handedly tying a black string around her hair..

the wrinkles in sarge are good but add more lighting and shadow to his face, it seems too plain

[This message has been edited by psi burn (edited June 18, 2000).]

[ZakatH]

Lo! =)

I think that "string" is her glasses.. 'cos it is Mynx isn't it? =)

[Cos]

Kos its lookin pretty cool so far. I like the composition and dynamicness of it. The borg looks phat man, good depth to it.

I don't really think I can add anything to the advice already given, so I'll just repeat what Francis said about thinking more about a main light source, one thing I have noticed you don't do enough of in your pics. Thats something I gotta worker harder at too, itll make everything look much more solid and real. Anyways good luck with
it!

[micke]

Not a bad start at all
Yeah, i think Mozeman said it all.More dynamic and more well defined lightsources.
I also agree with the different styles.
you might make the chicks boots a bit bigger maybe.

-Micke

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-Mikael Noguchi-

http://www.katode.org/noguchi/

[Francis]

I missed Mozeman's comments - what did he say?

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TeamGT Studios

[Cos]

I think he was in disguise as that Francis Tsai bloke ;p

[Joachim]

looks good kos. mandis. nice start !

As for comments. I think Francis gave you very good and serious feedback...so, I don't have much else to add.
About exaggeration of shapes, I really like what francis said. But of course, it also depends a lot about how much and how you want to exaggerate things, but what really made the difference is the composition. So, if I were you I would start working on the composition before doing anything else.
I often put too little work myself into the composition, which is something that really bothers me, since it can really make the difference between a good and a bad picture.


Anyway, looking forward to see your next version of the image.

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Joachim
web: http://home.sol.no/~jbarrum/

[kurisu]

lol Francis

I really like your style, kos.mandis. I think there are things you could do to change this piece - but whether changing it would make it better is really up to you. I don't know about anyone else, but I find that if I focus too much on any one part of a picture before laying down a strong enough foundation (like composition or basic color/lighting scheme, for example) a couple of things tend to happen: 1) I get very focused on details and I lose the overall sense of what my picture is about - and this can span from colors used, to the layout or composition or mood... readability, proportions, lighting... the list goes on. 2) Once I take a step back to really look at the picture, I notice that I've missed some basic elements - it's too late to change them, too much work to patch up the holes (that end up looking patched up) and then I start to dislike the picture quickly... resenting the fact that I missed those things I should have thought of or done better� and just ended up 'ruining' my picture. This is the point at which I might stop working on the picture. Funny thing - all that was in my mind... That doesn't happen much anymore, but I know that feeling all too well.

Tell me, kos, are you happy with the foundation of your picture? I'm not asking because I don't like it - because I think it can be a wonderful image (I've seen your stuff). I ask only to see how you feel about it. I sense some possible similarities and am wondering if you feel/felt any of this stuff I'm pooping out here.

I'm guessing that since you stopped working on this for awhile, there might be some hesitance to continue? My opinion is that your style is great and that this picture, even without modification could be great. Comments about composition, color foundation and balancing, dynamic posing, exaggeration... all good. But what do you want this pic to be?

My guess, looking at your sketch, kos, is that you approached this picture with a very broad general sketch, and at least a vague idea of how you imagine it looking when finished - and then jump to the details, finishing each part bit by bit (so to speak ). If so, I think this image will shape up dramatically as you work out each part... as a result, I can't critique your sketch too much, because your end goal will be quite different, I think. Does this make any sense? Wake up! lol

At least at this point, you seem to be at a stage where you can make great stuff approaching the art from a more detailed stand-point... I think the general will come later (in terms of approaching an from the very beginning image).

Just my verbal diarrhea for your sleeping pleasure... perhaps it's something to think about. Perhaps it's something to burn and run away from... No offense intended. Only opinions...

-kurisu

[micke]

Correction for my earlier reply:
I referred to Francis comments, not Mozemans


------------------
-Mikael Noguchi-

http://www.katode.org/noguchi/

[kos.mandis]

Whoaaa!! A shitload of replies, thanx guys!!

Ex: Thanx, but I "dropped" the hand anyway

Froooost: (like Blade said it ) Thank you a lot, your comments were really helpfull. You've got a great eye, that's Caprice's lips up there (I was keeping that for a surprise, THANX A LOT DUDE! ). Note: I didn't paste her face in there, I had done a pencil of her face earlier in a sketchbook from which I had a look and made the shape of the mouth.- I though it would be a cool element. Have another look at the new image, I got it some lightning (I'll tweak the colors later, I keep it in mind).

Vebjorn: That was news to me, thanx! And the mirroring idea, I wasn't using it but seeing how crap it looks flipped, I've just got to!

Tinusch: Spooky stuff, who knows what they are thinking! ("I don't know")

Francis: Hehe, let me get the foreground correct to begin with! Thank you a lot for the image, it was a GREAT help...(Actually, I liked your pose a lot better, but I don't want to change mynx). I get so stuborn I just keep drawing...(not this time!) I will dessaturate the colors when I'm done coloring (so that I keep using the same style, and tweak it all together at the end so that it looks all the same).

zapman: What can I do, they are such showoffs when you put a camera in front of them Nice one about the hand, I'll probably do it that way (I had though it for a while, but I was goind to put another character in front of him and it would look as if he was going to squash his head, plus I'm lazy)

psi burn: You were right about the boobs, I fixed them (that's the bad think with boobs, you get distracted too much to notice other things ). Hey, a major quake3 player would have know that Mynx would be holding her glasses (where, they're not done yet)

ZakatH: ...and there he is! (see a line up)

Cos: Hey you lazy bastard, you let the others do all the typing! And how did you manage to turn this around to you again??? Hey chill out, you can't take a joke-stop sending me these cyborg assassins of yours, it's the third one I destroyed this week!

micke: Thanks man, have a look at the new pic and tell me what you think about the boots size

Francis: Oops, I forgot to put Mozeman on my initial subject! Oh well, he won't kill meEAAAAAHHHH

Joachim: Thanx, most times I just go blind painting senseless... I'm trying to learn dammit!

kurisu: Yes, I get exactly the same, I fill it up with detail before I have even posed everybody (stupid and stuborn). But not this time, I'll just scrapp some crap and make it right dammit!!! When I started, I did Tank jr's head, and I DIDn't like how it turned out... A couple of weeks later I thought to do go on with the image on some other part, so a started Mynx, which turned out great... I think as time passes, I regard thinks different as to what is right, and what is not ...

Here is a rough of the rough (!)


Here is the image with some modifications so far...


Thank you all again for your time, it's really helping me! whohoo!!

[Cos]

kos u bum! I havent got a fkkin clue what you're on about (again =D) but your pic's lookin much better man, better composition, and the borg looks much happier too! must be the way she's rubbing his head =D. The guy in the foregrounds arm pointing tho.. looks wrong. You should get someone to do that pose for you and see how it looks. Hadde I want this finished by tonight!

[Fred Flick Stone]

Kos, this image is a nice composition. To tell you the truth, I like the girls face in the pencil comp, more than the one you painted. I think the way the colors are laid out in her flesh, she looks a bit on the bronzed side. Or a can tan...The face in your drawing has a nice sorta Joe Maduiera style to it, making her look much more attractive. Her boobs are too balloony, but that could work if you stick with the comic book look. And watch out for her knee. You are starting to invent a new type of knee, not anatomically correct to the human form. It is also attached to a beauty of a girl, so you really want to deemphasize the anatomy, and make it more attractive, using attractive shapes. Think simple. Take a look at how Joe Mad articulates his knees, or some of the other comic greats, they always take shortcuts to explaining something anatomically.

[Masaccio]

hey kos
ive been lookin round on tha net lately and found digitalart.com or sompthin and has a lot of yers and dhabihs work on it was really cool(just thoiguth id let ya know )
anywayz im pretty crap but i know one thing
tits arent that round dood on tha first one id change tha shape abit
cya round
maz

[Kyri]

Kos, pic is looking great, I like the changes you've made to the woman, she's looking much better preportionaly, although I think I would make her butt a bit bigger, but that just might be me and my preference in that department, heh, heh. ;P I kinda liked the agonised look on the robots face you had before tho. I think it's good that you have incorporated some of the lighting from Francis's sketch into the foreground character. I gotta agree with bro about the arm tho. Anyway enough of my waffles, just keep at it, great job.

[Incarnatation]

it looks like kylie manouge to me

[synj]

whats with the exclusive feedback only shit you got going here. thats gay eheh

-synj www.synj.net

[kos.mandis]

Cos: Hehe, I'll do that... Ok it'll be ready tonight, now get back to ur igloo!

Kyri: Hehe, no harm in giving some more, besides she is sitting! Cheers matey!

Fred: Lol, I've tweaked it a bit for now, it should look better, no?

Masaccio: Thanks, it's ok I had sent some...

Incarnatation: Hahah, Kylie's face and danie's boobs...

Synj: Everybody can reply, i just wanted some of these names in the replies cause they are real pros and I admire they art... Didn't it work?
(I'd come to u if it was an animation )

Thank you everybody, I'll paint it and post it nearly finished... (oh no, not again!)
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[Tinusch]

Kos, what's the deal with your site taking up the full screen? At least put in some Close This Window buttons or something... I had to Alt+Ctrl+Del to close the pictures...