Sijun Forums :: View topic - Cyborg Jedi

Al Ian · Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2003 10:08 pm

Here is a sketch on what I am attempting next. Multiple light sources... should be fun!?!? Plan to make this one light enough to be able to SEE what he looks like. I am realizing leaving more to the imagination and less to the eye in art isnt that popular lol. Smile

EDIT: Here is the full image tree. Go to the second page to see where I am now.

Cyborg Jedi Full Tree

C&C from this step on welcome as always.
_________________

http://jmarkey77.home.bresnan.net/

Tinusch · Posted: Tue Nov 04, 2003 7:14 am

That character is really confusing me. I can't quite read his pose.

Al Ian · Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2003 6:01 pm

Here are the lines to show what the Jedi is doing. Does this help? Is it still to confusing? Dont want to take this to the next step if you cant tell whats going on Smile

Jedi Lines
See first post for image tree

C&C Welcome!!
_________________

http://jmarkey77.home.bresnan.net/

Nendil · Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2003 9:06 pm

Hi -

I have to say at first I really had trouble figuring out the pose too. I think, the problem I had was that, when looking at a figure, I tend to orient myself by seeking out a head. But in this picture, there are three shapes (head, front hand, leg/foot) that are very similar in overall shape and size and it's pretty hard to distinguish between them. Add the fact that your character has his face obscured, and it gets kinda tough to figure out what's going on in the picture.

I'm not sure how you can improve on that; maybe you can play around with different perspectives and find one that puts more emphasis on the action. The character has a very dynamic pose, yet it gets partially canceled out by showing him in profile, not rushing towards any target in particular. Also, putting him in the dead center of the picture makes for a somewhat flat composition - there's not many areas of interest that leads the eye, aside from the (relatively small) character himself.

Just a few thoughts, feel free to disregard...
_________________
Moonlit Engravings

Al Ian · Posted: Thu Nov 06, 2003 5:42 pm

Hmmm... I think I know what you mean. Let me give this sketch another shot and see what happens.
_________________

http://jmarkey77.home.bresnan.net/

Al Ian · Posted: Thu Nov 06, 2003 6:29 pm

OK, I strained over your advice and came up with this. I see what you mean about the image feeling flat. Hadent noticed it but now it realy bothers me.

This is the first redraw, I need to correct the saber as its not very straight. However I am much happier with the pose. Thoughts before I continue?

Jedi
See first post for image tree
_________________

http://jmarkey77.home.bresnan.net/

Merystic · Posted: Fri Nov 07, 2003 5:21 pm

I like the new pose much better, much more understandable and balanced.
I look forward to seeing colors added as well.
_________________
Stay Frosty!

"Dreams are necessary to life." --Anais Nin

Al Ian · Posted: Fri Nov 07, 2003 8:52 pm

I've taken this two steps farther tonight. Need sleep so I am stopping where I am at. I finished the line art for the drawing. The lower left will probably be fire of some sort. Not 100% on that yet. Might be one to many light sources at this time for me. The plan is to make his armor partialy reflective, kind of like a new car. To where you can see the stars and the moon in the reflections along with his light saber.

Thoughts?

Jedi Line Art
See first post for image tree

Jedi v0.1
See first post for image tree

EDIT
Looking at it at this size. I am also thinking of pushing the Jedi to the right more. He takes up to much of the center right now. It bothers me.
_________________

http://jmarkey77.home.bresnan.net/

Al Ian · Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2003 7:19 am

One step closer. You can see what the saber will look like. Not sure if I'm finished with the saber yet. You can see the varience in color in his armor. Also where I placed the Jedi as aposed to where he was. Thoughts?

Jedi v0.2
See first post for image tree
_________________

http://jmarkey77.home.bresnan.net/

Al Ian · Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2003 8:41 am

Started to highlight the Jedi. Some area's just dont seem right yet I cant place my finger on it. Any help at this point would be very helpful.

Jedi v.03
See first post for image tree
_________________

http://jmarkey77.home.bresnan.net/

fukifino · Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2003 10:15 am

Oooooh...hadn't checked in on this one in a while...I really like the redesign, and I dig the finished line art. The coloring is coming along quite nicely also. Possibly one of your best developed pictures yet. Keep going!

Only comment I have right now is that you might give some thought as to what he's looking at/facing off against...the viewer being behind him would work much better if we have some sense of what he's facing.

Al Ian · Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2003 1:22 pm

Rancor!
_________________

http://jmarkey77.home.bresnan.net/

Al Ian · Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2003 2:24 pm

Refined the Jedi a bit more. I am very unhappy with his feet. They are just bothering me. Not sure what Im going to do yet.... Confused

Thank you for the advice on something to focus on fukifino. I wasent sure what to do but as the post above says I decided on a Rancor. Good news is it will look cool when its done. Bad news is I cant draw one from my head very well lol. Google's got crap for reference material on this so far. Wish me luck!

Jedi v0.4
See first post for image tree
_________________

http://jmarkey77.home.bresnan.net/

Al Ian · Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2003 5:32 pm

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh......................................

I found a few good refferences for the Rancor. I sketched him in, turned off all of the other layers so I could concentrate on the Rancor and began to paint. I painted for over 2 hours on this beast. I turn the other layers back on and what do I find? I DIDNT USE THE SAME LIGHT SOURCE AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!! Dangit!!!!

OK, my hand hurts and I'm hungry. This is as far as I have gotten. Probably gonna leave it alone til tomorrow and try to "fix" the Rancor's light source then. Its gonna be a pain Sad

Jedi v0.5
See first post for image tree
_________________

http://jmarkey77.home.bresnan.net/

Tinusch · Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2003 8:59 pm

That's looking really good, I'd add a mist over the Rancor, make him stand out a little less and add some depth.

Al Ian · Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2003 7:20 am

Didnt take me as much work as I thought it would to adjust the light source. This looks much more accurate! I also added mouth, teeth, and claws. Need to continue to cool down and darken the shadows for the Rancor. I also took your advice Tinusch and added a fog effect. Not sure if this is what you were getting at. I think I made it to bright. Gonna give it another shot after breakfest!

Thoughts?

Jedi v0.6
See first post for image tree
_________________

http://jmarkey77.home.bresnan.net/

Al Ian · Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2003 1:45 pm

I redid the fog, and started to cool down the Rancor in an attempt to show distance between the two. Not so sure I'm happy with the results on this one. Kind of frustraited at this point. Any pointers?

See first post for image tree
_________________

http://jmarkey77.home.bresnan.net/

Tinusch · Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2003 2:50 pm

I was thinking something more like this...

I'd also extend the canvas a little more to the left so you're not cropping the Rancor in half. The composition feels very cramped.

Mega Muffin · member Member # Joined: 07 Oct 2003 Posts: 235

maybe try moving the Rancor over to the right some, putting a bit of his head behind the lightsaber would help bring more depth, and even help it to be less cramped. On another note, I think this looks awsome and I can't wait to see the final product.

Al Ian · Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 7:11 pm

Tinusch - I think I see what you mean. However he has the "Ghost Rancor from Star Wars Past" feel to him now dont you think?

However where I was most upset is that it feels so wrong. I think your right, gonna streach out the image and add more Rancor!!

Also gonna play with moving the Rancor over a bit to see if that gives me more depth. I also thought of bluring the image of the rancor a bit to give the Jedi more focus. We'll see what tonights round of "paint til you pass out" yields!
_________________

http://jmarkey77.home.bresnan.net/

Al Ian · Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 7:53 pm

Alright, I started to paint in the Rancor. I moved him but felt having his face partialy blocked took away from his anger and cool level. This does give me a more open feel. Course now I have to either repaint the whole rancor or get the left half to match the right half lol. Ouch.

See first post for image tree
_________________

http://jmarkey77.home.bresnan.net/

Mega Muffin · member Member # Joined: 07 Oct 2003 Posts: 235

looks awsome! Only thing is the Rancor's right (from his view) looks too big. Make it smaller, and that'll be more like the hand is pushing out.

Al Ian · Posted: Wed Nov 12, 2003 6:12 pm

ok, I shrank the MASSIVE ARM OF DEATH... err, thined it out a bit. Cleaned it up a bit. Worked on it a bit more.

Here is the clean up.
See first post for image tree

I used a blur filter and turned the opacity down, this is the results. I think I like it. Thoughts?
See first post for image tree
_________________

http://jmarkey77.home.bresnan.net/

Bob Loblaw · junior member Member # Joined: 04 Nov 2003 Posts: 17

Its cool to see the progress on this piece. The crits that you took from people and addressed in your work most definitely tighten it up. The only thing I can add is besides the fact that it'd be cool to see more of the setting you've placed your characters in, is that...

You've got a knack for the cartoon-character proportions and poses as evidenced in your Jedi, however, the beast he's fighting is realistically rendered. While this work is probably well down the path towards "completion" -- ever consider making the Jedi realistic? or the monster cartoony? So that they "live" in the same universe?

I may be way off base here, that's just my �2...

Al Ian · Posted: Wed Nov 12, 2003 7:07 pm

Bob, I know I know. Its bothering me still. Thats why I havent done a whole lot to it. I guess I should just shut up and start trying to draw a toony Rancor. It'll be tough though.

Any idea's on where to start lol.
_________________

http://jmarkey77.home.bresnan.net/

Al Ian · Posted: Wed Nov 12, 2003 8:32 pm

ok, sketched out a Rancor. I used alot of refferences to do this. Not sure if I'm 100% happy with it. Before I proceed, thoughts?

Rancor
See first post for image tree
_________________

http://jmarkey77.home.bresnan.net/

Al Ian · Posted: Wed Nov 12, 2003 9:25 pm

Other thoughts Ive had here while looking at the art I've done. (Yes I lurk my own thread scrolling up and down insainly at times until WHAM I see whats wrong, ok so Im a freak!)

I have an idea on the background I want to add. Need to get more StarWars refference material, but it'll be worth it. A total rework of the background is called for. Something from Tatooin (sp).

Also want to streach it out further to the right, so no cliping of the Rancor accures, as well as giving more of a view of the background. I get the feeling that it will make you realize a little more that the Rancor IS the focus of the Jedi.

I like the bluring effect on the Rancor, so that will probably reaccure in the next rendition of this work. Brings your eyes to the Jedi a good bit I think.

Thoughts?

(P.S.- Yes, Im possesed.)
_________________

http://jmarkey77.home.bresnan.net/

Bob Loblaw · junior member Member # Joined: 04 Nov 2003 Posts: 17

You are possessed.

I regret opening my big stupid mouth and making you question your process...

I think the path to caricture is a process of simplification and amplification. Simplifying the details of the subject at hand and amplifying them to cartoonish proportions. People respond to cartoon characters the same way they respond to babies and baby animals; creatures with disproportionately big heads and eyes. Our brains are hard-wired to be receptive to cuteness so our initial reaction is to coddle them and not throttle them!

Look at these 'super-deformed' version of familiar monsters. Somehow they're cute when their originals are loathesome!

You're own signature alien characters fall well within this category. Child-like proportions: big heads, big eyes. Mickey Mouse, Porky Pig and almost any anime babe you can imagine do too!

So one way to cartoonifying the rancor might be to imagine what it would look like as a baby. I tried sketching this but its not too successful...

I hope that helps a bit...

Al Ian · Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2003 6:11 am

Myself never have taken a real art class dont know these rules. And I dont read anything non-work related either lol.

I do see what you mean. Hmmm.... when I get home tonight I've got some work to do!
_________________

http://jmarkey77.home.bresnan.net/

Bob Loblaw · junior member Member # Joined: 04 Nov 2003 Posts: 17

If only my art school saw comics and cartooning as a valid form of expression I wouldn't be the 'schizoid' artist I am today...

Besides, those 'rules' are principles that every aspiring comic artists 'knows' instinctually. Check out your characters, they're poster-children for them! Plus those 'rules' came from Scott McCloud's 'Understanding Comics' book. As a cartoonist yourself, you might consider getting your hands on that book -- furthermore, its a comic book about comic books so its really a fun read...