Sijun Forums :: View topic - Water Dragon

Carnivore · Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2001 12:08 pm

Cool scene, but there are some suggestions..

1: the DOF... you have it a bit too extreme. having the background that blury makes the dragon look about 4 inches tall..

2: Stretching textures... the white belly texture looks a smidge stretched... put the belly texture on a seperate channel and throw on just a planar UVW modifier for it on the belly... that should work...

3: maybe some brighter Sunlight.....

besides that its looking good.. =)

Good luck

Dryfire · Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2001 7:08 pm

i think it loks great

Tendril · Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2001 7:44 pm

Its pretty cool! I like the texture, how its nice and shiny. Although youve got some stretching. and youve done the water splashes well, that is pretty dificult to do in 3d.

I would play around with the lighting a bit more too. It seems overlit to me, try and get some more shadows, you may be able to make the texture stretching less noticable.

Your right about there being very few good 3d dragons. Theyre are billions of crappy looking ones, because thats the first thing that all newbies want to model.

Glondus · Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2001 7:50 pm

I cant help but picture a model train right infront of it, just out of the line of sight...

But its really cool

Fat Assasin · Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2001 8:35 pm

Thanks for the comments. I think I will play around with it some more. Right now the textures are pretty simple, mainly just solid color with bump maps, so I'll put more detail in there and fix the stretching.

Carnivore: That's an interesting comment about the DOF, I never thought of that, but you're right. For some reason it always looked like a toy model (baby train coming through!) and that must be why. I'll fix that too. Maybe even put some characters in there for scale.

Thanks again everyone!

Fat Assasin · Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2001 11:28 pm

I did this in Max with patch modelling. I can't decide if I should go more photo-realistic or keep it 3d looking. Any crits welcome.

[ August 01, 2001: Message edited by: Fat Assasin ]

simuartist · Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2001 11:34 pm

The model looks good. I think the answer to your question lies in what you will use it for in the end?? Is it for your demo reel and if so what kinds of companies will you apply to. There are a myriad of questions I could ask...but I like a more realistic dragon myself...there are a million fake looking cartoony dragons but very few good looking realistic dragons...

Fat Assasin · Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2001 11:47 pm

Hmmm, just the fact that there are few good looking realistic ones out there makes me want to go that direction. I just gotta be different!

And yeah, it's for my portfolio. I'm trying to break into the gaming biz (along with everyone else).

Kallen · Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2001 3:37 am

I am not familiar with 3D programs. Is there a way to make it look less plastic and more realistic? I think how in the new Jurasic Park movie they have the dinasaurs faces nearly land in your lap and so realistic! It would be fantastic if you could get the same 3D look with a realistic dragon.
Also I think you need to sharpen the backgound on this a bit. Way too blurry and it hurts the scale of the dragon too. Makes it look like a toy sitting on the beach. Perhaps a few characters for scale would help that too. How about a different color for the Dragon? Purple is my favorite color but it makes me think of Barnie if it is used on Dragons.

Just trying to help

and hope you make it to gaming!

-------------

Kay Allen - Artist of RealmsQuest

Fat Assasin · Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2001 10:00 am

I'm going to bust out my copy of "Walking With Dinosaurs" on DVD and do some research. I think if I make the textures more photo-real and plop him in an actual photograph instead of a 3D created scene, that will enhance the reality tremendously. I want this to look like I was just wandering by and happened to capture him on film.

Fat Assasin · Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2001 5:12 pm

Here's an updated version. I don't know that's it really any better. I think my best bet is to take what I've learned on this one and just start on another model.

]Aratex[ · Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2001 9:21 pm

I wouldn't ditch him entirely, the model is great, I think the problem lies in the skinning... Here's my advice, take it or leave it.

First of all, I think you should consider changing the color.. No offense, I love metallic blue as much as anyone else, but not many creatures (even water dragons) are quite that shade of blue.. The specular highlights on his snout, etc. help a little, but I really think the color scheme could stand being totally changed.
Second, add some more variation to the skin.. The spot on his left shoulder was a nice touch, I think it needs more stuff like that.. Maybe some scars or little bumpy things or something? A lot of the challenge of creating organics is that they're so symmetrical and yet so totally random... I think that capturing that is one of the biggest challenges you'll ever face.
Finally, I really think that changing to the actually photograph background really helped out the image.. and I also think it's a great model.. I really, really think that some skin work would do wonders for this guy..

Good luck.. I hope you stick with him, you've come so far already...

Fat Assasin · Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2001 10:02 pm

Thanks for the encouragement. I probably will go back to him after I've done some other things. I really don't like leaving images in a state I'm not happy with.

Thanks again.

Carnivore · Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2001 10:17 pm

Excellent job fixing his belly texture.. and the DOF issue also.. looks much better..
and either you change the lighting or changed some properties on the textures cuz he looks darker.. better though.. it was a change for the better... still though.. something about the light aint right.. one thing would be shadows.. and maybe you already have it, but I'm looking to see a strong direct sunlight beaming on him, then some dim secondary lighting as the sun bounces off the dirt, water, and greenery.... or if you wanna get really excited, (and realistic) download and use Brazil. Its a free plugin in beta currently that does a great job with realistic reflections, refractions, transparencies, DOF(and that funky bokeh effect), and best of all.... global and secondary illumination. Its great. .. a bit slow maybe when you have the secondary and global lighting on, and especially slow if you mix that with any kind of reflections or transparencies, but cool.... go to www.splutterfish.com and take a peak through the galleries there. Some VERY cool stuff to see... then if you feel like having some fun download it... and a note, in order for it to render nice you have to add the Brazil Renderer as an effect in your.. effects list.. =) .. and for your textures to take advantage of the Brazil renderer they need to be a "Brazil Test mtrl" or somethin like that... it's just under the list of other material types....

BTW: it was formerly called GHOST...

anywho, good luck!

Fat Assasin · Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2001 10:35 pm

Thanks for the heads-up about Brazil. There are some damn fine renders in the gallery. Very impressive. I think I might just have to try it out (I love playing with new toys).

About the dragon, yeah, I reduced the ambient light which made him darker. I also desatured the skin quite a bit. And I've also tried to simulate some reflected light off the water with a secondary light. That reflected light is always a trouble spot when I'm trying to do something realistic, especially an outdoors scene.

simuartist · Posted: Fri Jul 27, 2001 9:04 am

I think the best way for you to get the lighting right on this guy...I just think the hot spots are to hot and he looks to shiney...anyways like I was saying the best way for you to get a feel of what this guy should look like emerging from the water would be to see what a crocadile looks like in the same situation.

[edit] Just so you know I think you did a great job...looking at the before and after is a big diffrence. But remember to be consistant ...the detail on the face should be as clear as the detail on the chest it the same distance ...you would expect to see a very scaly face..like the chest

[ July 27, 2001: Message edited by: simuartist ]

AC · Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2001 5:43 am

That looks incredible now, with the photo background and improved textures! The only thing I'd do to it now, is just try and do something with the little bit of ground that he has his paw/claws resting on, as it look a bit plain compared to the background. Otherwise, it looks stunning.

-Andy-
--www.coates11.freeserve.co.uk

Fat Assasin · Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2001 9:08 am

I agree about the foreground now. It looks very 3d-ish compared to the background.

The main problem I've been having with this guy is trying to make him look wet (considering he's just come out of the water) without making him look metallic or plastic. It's been a real pain trying to reproduce the random nature of water. I think I might forget about that and just assume he's been out of the water for some time and has dried off.