[EBE]

This is a Comic Face I had in mind. It is totally done in Painter and Photoshop.
Hope you like it.
Glenn



Wanna see more of my stuff? just go to: http://members.tripod.de/EBE1947/

[hamilton]

first of all, learn to crop your images. there is antirely too much white on this image that is only hindering file size. secondly, as comic faces go, this isn't very interesting. it's plain and ordinary with absolutely nothing to set it apart. when drawing stubble in phoshop, it's good practice to set the fade on your brush to a set length instead of normal or stylus, so that they are all the same length and so that they generally look decent. fourth. this didn't need to be this big. we could have gotten the gyst of it in a smaller image. lastly. it's not drawn well at all. the ear is too small and too high up. it's obvious that you're trying to draw an asian character, so i'll forgive a couple other mistakes, but if you're planning on doing any sort of comicbook something, i'd suggest you practice the real thing before you start exaggerating facial features, because without firm knowledge of the human form, your drawings are just gonna look like crap. you don't need to take courses to fix this, just go out and draw actual people. don't draw what you want to see, draw what is actually there. but practice a whole lot more.

all in all, i'm not sure why you bothered to post this here, it would have been better served in the works in progress forum. oh well.

and oh yeah, this forum isn't here to baby anyone. if you don't like my crit, then you shouldn't put your pics here.

and don't be afraid to color the whole thing. that's one hell of a highlight on his cheek.

[Littlepoop77]

If EBE doesn't cry, I think I will.. Man...rufff!

I do agree with Hamilton on the technical side.

Something positive... EBE: keep drawing from observation and do your own stuff occasionally...Just have fun and don't let things get to you....cuz there are some bosses out there that would scream and yell at you...

I think Hamilton is either a producer or an Art director...he sounds like one

[EBE]

So this is all in all a bad picture? Thanks a lot! I don�t cry, but nothing positive in this picture? I agree with the small ear. I will fix it. But all in all bad drawn? I think this is matter of opinion and taste.
And why not posting in this Forum? If I have the opinion this Picture is finished, then it belongs to the finished art Gallery.
And I also don�t think this Face is unintersting.
I really would like to know, what you�re saying to my other pictures Hamilton. If you�ve got time, then go to:
http://members.tripod.de/EBE1947/

All bad drawn stuff?
Please don�t say that.........

[silber]

Hamilton:
I generally agree with you

but please first think of to who you are talking to
I don't know EBE but maybe he's some years younger than you or just started late drawing

and maybe this picture is a great progress
for him and he's proud of it

look at your pictures you drew some years ago-in your eyes crap--some years ago you was proud of them--in a few years you will see pictures you drew nowerdays and say the same thing

we all know that the level of this forum is very high and one should not post every doodle one make
but if you think a picture don't deserve any attention cause of his quality or any other reason just ignor it or make a general ''friendlier'' comment

harsh criticism is good for more experienced
artist but not always good for young ones

hope I could make my point with my poor english

but as I said before I agree with you
and I personaly prefer this harsh critiscm

-silber

[ June 24, 2001: Message edited by: silber ]

[Optical]

I don't know why the pic is getting bashed so horribly... it may be stylised but it is still a cool looking pic..

[hamilton]

ok. i take back the "bad drawing" quote. that was a bit hasty. i think that i was going for what silber said, and say that this seems like this wasn't exactly a picture high on your priorities list. i don't know your age or skill level, but this is a high art forum (with occasional silliness) that should only be bothered with the best work that you can produce. i hope this clears up everything. if this IS the best work that you can produce, than i hope you won't take offense to my saying you need to practice a lot more. if this isn't, than you can understand what i'm saying about the rest. whatever you do, don't stop drawing. esspecially because of something someone on an internet forum says :P


oh yeah, i just went and looked at your stuff. your animal stuff is very good, and shows plenty of promise. i liked the insect study you did. just apply that to humans. but i'm sure you used photographs for the insects. let me tell you that you don't want to do that when learning to draw humans. draw from life. go to the beach, or a mall, or church (if you do that) and draw people that you see. at first it won't be easy (as it wasn't for me when i started) but you will get better. start out only drawing forms. try to get a feeling of movement in your pictures as apposed to focusing on details. don't even worry about drawing the faces at first. draw people that are walking, and sitting, and laying down, and whatever. start noticing the way clothing folds around the body, especially take note of the way folds work in conjunction with the joints, such as knees and elbows. if you want to learn to draw faces, i suggest applying for a caricature position at a theme park (or even some malls) they will usually have a course that will teach you very valuable things, even if they don't hire you.

that's about it for now.

[ June 24, 2001: Message edited by: hamilton ]

[silber]

cheers

[EBE]

Hehe thank you Hamilton for taking back the hard words. I will try the things you said (drawing in a mall and try to catch movement of people, to get a feeling of the whole Human drawing, without the priority on faces)
C ya
Glenn

[hamilton]

plouffe. i thought my site was fairly easy to navigate. site>topic>drawing. pretty straight forward. you don't have to read anything just click links.

but as it is, i recently had a very involved layout that had iframes, so not everyone could view it. i decided to go extremely simple with this one. i have had that site for many years, and it has seen many incarnations. besides. the showcase isn't the site (it could be but it isn't) it's the art. so as long as you liked the art, i'm satisfied. :P

[Tinusch]

This isn't a "high art forum" where you can only post your absolute best. It's here for people of all skill levels to come and learn. No one said you have to be a professional or have to be the greatest artist to post your work. And everyone should be able to participate without being told they suck. We all start somewhere.

[Felaxx]

yeah hamilton! hehe I mean, even YOU have a lot to learn, as we all do. I think the best crits are the ones that let the artist know what is good and bad both, for how are you to know if you're going in the right direction if y ou don't know what parts to keep? For example... I kind of like the linework on this piece. It is a little rough around the edges, and I do think the piece looks boring but it is a practice piece. It holds on its own as a study. Just keep working and you'll hit something eventually. Don't let anyone discourage you from realizing your own personal style/goals.

[Frosted Flame]

Very well said Tinusch.

Having read all the comments in this thread, I have one question: where the hell do you get off cutting someone up like that "hamilton"? You speak as if you are some sort of almighty art god. I've seen your "stuff", and it most certainly does not fit into your definition of Sijun being a "high art forum". Your ego needs some serious deflating.

[adigra]

At first I didn't feel like joining this whole thing going on in this thread but more I read and thought about it more it bugged me. I really don't think that bashing someone's art will do any good to anybody. It makes the artist feel bad and has no positive influence and it makes the writer of the reply look like a self-righteous jackass. I really hope that this isn't an exclusive "high quality" art forum, I hope it's a place where we can reflect, influence and inspire one another and this place brings all of us with this common interest together. To say that one shouldn't post art here makes this forum seem very pompous and ignorant. I am glad that there is so many great artist posting here because it raises the bar and pushes the rest of the people to work that much harder.

I agree that there are some mistakes in this drawing by EBE but there are a lot of positive things too. Just the fact that someone dedicates time to drawing is positive.

Hamilton, the way you handled this whole thing throws a big shadow on you as a person and your art as a product of that. While your art is at a good level you should, if you chose to post your comments, use your skill to educate and not to make someone feel horrible about something so positive such as art. Even if a piece is bad (speaking hypothetically) you can use positive reinforcement to get your points across and make a person feel inspired as opposed to depressed. We are here to learn and share. If comments such as yours were a norm here I most definitely wouldn't stick around.

[Akolyte]

"High Art Forum" Sheesh, get with the program, we all suck

[Plouffe]

Hey Hamilton..

Nice crit... lots of good advice.. But was kinda harsh to begin with... Oh and you have alot of good work on your webpage by the way. But i dont like your webpage at all you should redo it from scratch.. If your trying to sell services or shocasing your work on the internet as an artist, your webpage is hard to navigate.. Well not really but lets say you want to see a picture you made well you have ALOT OF writing that is really boring to read and then you have numbers for the pictures that just really waste time...
Maybe changing this somehow?? would be VERY enjoyable to go to you webpage EVERYDAY if you do something about it...

Sorry for going offf topic.. i was looking at you webpage and just got pissed because it was kinda boring and crappy to navigate... BUt your a great artist and i really enjoy the pictures u posted... JUST DO SOMETHING ABOUT THE WEBPAGE =).. Oh and i understand if you dont have time hehe.. No harm meant at all just thought i would give my input...

[hamilton]

i in no way wish to fan the flames of this conversation anymore. but i'd like to at least point out that there was plenty of help in my first crit, and there was TONS in my second. i didn't JUST bash him (and i don't event hink i did that). and NO WHERE did i say i was good. there. now i'm done.

[Myself]

[Myself]

For making EBE happier can some of you post old pictures here if you have? I am very interested of your first tries.

[EBE]

Hi to all drawers that were send directly from god to serve us perfect Drawings in this "High Standard" Forum.
This isn�t my first try!!! I draw since a few years. Look at my pics at http://members.tripod.de/EBE1947/
and you will see there is much better stuff than this. I never thought this Picture could cause such a discussion. I saw much much worse stuff in this Forum and the people of this Forum were much friendlier without saying:" This is a High Standard Forum. Don�t bother People to Post this shit here"
And now please end this conversation.
I Think everything is said.
Thanks to all the People that tried to help me and give back my courage to draw on and on.
C ya
Glenn (EBE)

[Aimok]

Hehe, first I have to warn you.
I am perhaps not as good to post in this High quality Art Forum only for professionals
Excuse me, plz.

@ Ebe

This is an DIgital Art-Forum and the most people here are very influenced by classic art.So They see Comics with other eyes, so dont be negative influenced by such critics.
Hamillton has given many good advices, yeah, but such critic can influence negative an artist in his personal development. This is not productive,imho.

And there is no perfect Comic-Style, perhaps there are much more freedoms in COmics than in Digital.Art...

So keep YOUR own style, if u like White Backrounds , keep them. There is no wrong or right in Art...

[hamilton]

ok. i'm sorry guys, for keeping this up, but... no, no i'm not sorry. EBE you put words in my mouth. i was tired at the time and didn't bother to read my post again to confirm your claims, but never once did i use the term bad drawing. i also was not mean in the slightest. i may have been harsh/stern, but i was not mean. i gave MUCH help for everything i said that was wrong, i gave a way that you might fix it. i gave a very good crit, in my estimation, and i feel the need to justify myself to all the people that jumped down my throat. your thread was moving out of the first page with no comments when i looked at it. i wanted you to at least get something. because i figured that was the only possible you reason you could have posted something like this, was that you seriously wanted opinions.

as to the people that brought up MY art? what the hell? what does the way i draw have to do with me giving a decent criticism? the best critics in the world can't draw worth crap (not that i am making any comparison, just an analogy) i put MY drawings on MY site, for ME... and my friends. so don't bring up my art, unless you see it here. that's just picking at straws.

thirdly, this is ABSOLUTELY a high art forum. and by that, i mean that this is a place to put the highest caliber of art that you can muster. if you have a sketch that you're working on for something, i would say put it in the works in progress forum. but this one is for the best work that you can muster. high art doesn't mean hoity toity art. it just means high standards. i only come here, because when i'm looking through it, i expect to see the best that people can produce. simply because some people don't treat it like that, doesn't make it any less exactly that.

hmph... now look what you've all made me do. and by the way, now that i've seen your other stuff, i can absolutely say that this is not your best work. surely someone else if not you yourself EBE will agree with me on that. you have done much better and this is substandard compared with the main haul of your work.

... i'm open

[EBE]

Thanks Hamilton. Now I am satisfied. You said, that some of my other drawings are better. I really thought all my drawings are bad, after your crit, because I knew that I did some mistakes with "Comic Head" but I never thought, that I would get such bad crit. I really like your drawings on your homepage and I thought:"hmm if someone who can draw that good says something like this, then my drawings really have to be shit, because his eye sees everything!" And that really can put someone down for a while if you�re not that professional.
But I�m happy that you wrote the last reply. Thanks a lot
Glenn

[Gecko]

I think hamilton was harsh on his 1st reply, but cleared it on the second. his crit was really useful, and because of what he wrote i'm going out to draw now.

ebe, i suggest you follow the crits and keep drawing, I also agree that artists should post only their better work here.. i remember how it was before the split of the forums, with many of the posts having 5 minute scribbles in them.