[Holly Jolly]

This was a horrible movie, and it was nominated for Best Picture because everyone dies at the end, and we love communist. That stubborn little rich girl can DIE! I hate her, stabe her to death with her pathetic comb!!! (pathetic) Cool fighting, wire effects as sloppy as the Peter Pan broadway play. One of the worst movies ever! Burn! Burn! Burn!

[buyuu]

Yo momma!

[PandaX52]

yes, the rich girl was irritating, but I think that was the point...of her being irritating.

[sacrelicious]

Boo-urns.

[zero21]

Funny story,

Was in the car coming home from kickboxing with my brother (his car was in the shop so was giving him a lift) the conversation went something along the lines of:

Brother: saw CTHD the other night with shelly (G-Friend)
me: yeah? I got it out on DVD the other night, good film aye?
Brother: Yeah, though after work I was pretty tired and the subtitles were a bit too much for me to handlde to really enjoy it
me; subtitles? What subtitles?
LONG PAUSE
Brother: FFFFUUUUCCCCKKKKK !!!!!!!!

I thought it was generally a good movie, and god bless the language setup options on my DVD player! Little brother still kicking himself as DVD hire is cheaper than going to the movies here!

[KrassOtti]

I totally agree!

That Jen girl is so annoying... Throughout the whole movie it seems like she's supposed to be the hero but acts like the stupidest bithc ever.

That one character totally destroyed the movie for me. Heros are not supposed to be stupid bitches, that's reserved for the villains


Though the fighting was really cool

[MrPumpernickel]

I really do not feel like getting into this argument again...but PLESE zero, don't say that you saw the dubbed version!! For the love of God (or whatever)!!!

Subtitles rock, mouth-moves out of sync with speech SUCK!!!

Maybe I'll write a more conclusive description why the movie is great when I wake up in about 11 hours...or maybe I will not...

[Chris]

Now we are talking, a movie that deserves to be called stupid. I was very very disappointed in this movie. The martial arts was O.K., but that wire crap, there was WAY too much of it and it was pretty sloppy, especially the roof and tree scenes.

The scene with the woman and bitch princess in the work-out place was the best fight scene in the movie, liked how the woman kept grabbing different weapons and the princess kept destroying them with that sword.

But other then that, it was really slow and the camera work was really sloppy compared to other martial art films.

[ May 07, 2001: Message edited by: Chris ]

[Gimbal8]

She was the hero?! Watching it dubbed?!

Jesus!

It's no wonder people think The Matrix is all that and CTHD is stupid. It's like I took a wrong turn and walked into opposite-ville where meaning is meaningless.

Shame on me for replying. I should know better. I know better. You know better and I've been had. Lesson learned. I'm going to find my room now. Sorry to interupt. Continue your discussion. Bye.

[Frost]

I loved the movie. Wonderful scenes, actors and action sequences. Sure, it's far from being realistic -- most of the floating parts are downright goofy looking, but hey... it's a fantasy movie.

[KrassOtti]

Gimbal8: Alright, I shouldn't have said "hero", but she is still the main actor/focus of the whole thing.

[[P]aradox]

Learn the language, it's much much more enjoyable

[Holly Jolly]

Yea. When I saw it in the theaters all the Chinese dudes were laughing, then all the English speaking people were laughing a couple minutes later. When I realized it was because we had to read the subtitles I started laughing. -Everyone turns to look at me.-


Yes, the fighting was awesome, but that's were it ends, seriously, I wanted to kill that girl so bad it isn't even funny.

Hopefully the sequal is much better. (Yes, and they are making a sequal.)

[Red Leader]

well, I liked the story, but the effects looked BAD on screen. Sure, I know it was all real actors doing incredible stunts, and I respect that a great deal, but if digital touchups in the editing room could have helped make the movie more mystically believable, they should have done it. The "flying" sequences ruined the movie for me, they were so bad.

[Guy]

not to like change the subject somewhat, but if you want a good martial arts movie. see jackie chan's drunkin master.. i that was a really good movie. sweet fight scenes. good story and its just fun to watch... anyways back to the CTHD debate.. i havnt seen it so i cant really say anything about it.

[Ian]

Blah. You guys must not have seen the shitty kung-fu shows here in singapore. THEY'RE AWFUL. Crouching tiger hidden dragon whatever, is NOTHING MORE than these cheesy shows made full length. With chow yun fat stuck into the middle of it. yaaaay! It was a kinda cool plot and evil bitchy girl with the sword is cute ^_^ But other than that this movie mainly sucked.

[FatPenguin]

I'd be interested to know why any of you think it's worse than any of the 1000+ stupid hollywood action films that are pumped out each year

and to the guy who said the girl was too bitchy to be a hero, yeah, i agree, movies suck when they don't have a flawless, noble hero, fighting an infinitely evil one dimensional villain

[Jezebel]

CTHD was one of my favorite movies of all time. Why? Because the whole thing is gorgeous. Who the hell cares if that girl was bitchy? It was her character, and if you didn't like her that means the actress did an excellent job in the role.

The fight scenes were unique and fun to watch, the music and costume design was beautiful, the environments were beautiful and I thought the story was interesting. I loved reading the subtitles too.. I would never ever watch that movie dubbed into English, it would be awful. Please go back and watch the subtitled version, hehe

[Ian]

Run Lola Run /w Subtites kicks ass.

Dubbed it sucks muchly.

I love that movie too.

[Lunatique]

Why didn't anyone mention the love stories? To me, the best part of the film were the love stories. The whole desert scene was very romantic.

I hated the wire stuff. They looked so silly just floating about. Being "enlightented" is one thing, floating like Superman is another thing altogether. If Lee had only made them look like they had more physical weight, it would've worked much better.

If you want to see a very good martial arts film with incredible fighting sequences that are intense, yet realistic, go rent BLADE(NOT the Wesly snipes vampire flick, but the Chinese martial arts flick).

[ToastyKen]

This thread is in mortal danger of becoming a flame war, but I feel compelled to chime in that I adored the Jen character.. She's the main reason I like the movie. She kicks ass, and she's idealistic. She's whiny not because she's crazy, but because everyone else is! (Kinda like Carl in Sling Blade...) She's trying to aspire to her dreams, but the world she lives in is just so crappy that she can't stand it. If anything, blame the world, not her.

[wayfinder]

CTHD is, in my humble but undoubtably RIGHT opinion a great movie. When i was watching the flight scenes, i took them first as a metaphor for what was really going on (i don't know if they were intended that way, but it works), and i idly mused about the possibility that things REALLY happened THIS way (and that works too). maybe you have to be slightly schizophrenic to understand the movie

but you all know it: schizos get twice the fun.

[edible snowman]

you know what was great about the flying scenes? they were funny as hell. they probably weren't supposed to be, but they were. everyone else in the theater was all serious because it was a "foreign film," but my friends and i couldnt stop laughing. it was hilarious. plus, when you have fight scenes, its nice to see people that actually know martial arts.

[Impaler]

Actually, I think you guys have it backwards. If a character can annoy you so much that it actually ruined the movie for you, then it was good acting, and generally a GOOD MOVIE.

The choreography was what really made this movie shine. Watch the near-beginning scene where Fat was fighting off the brat princess with a stick, whereas she had the Green Destiny. He had a sort of calm and control about him, where she was flailing wildly about. The choreography expressed more in that movie more than words ever could. It was the classic struggle of master over brilliant student. I'll admit, however, that the flying out of rooms was fucking cheesy, and bit detracting, even if it did have the point of enlightenment. The fight scenes moved so fast that you have to watch it 20 times in slow motion just to even hope to catch all of the moves. There were some definite high-level martial arts going on in this movie.

Oh, and Michelle Yeoh is hella hot.

[Holly Jolly]

Actually you got it all wrong. Its not "good acting" its called a horrible STORY! Who wants to watch a pathetic foriegn film with a girl that whines gets her way, and changes her mind every two seconds? Horrible characters, who ever developed such characers should be killed. And true, amybe the girl isn't a "bitch" in real life, but then again what girl isn't? Ouch! The movie was horrible, I wanted to burn her, I wanted to burn the director, ect. Thank goodness it didn't win Best Picture or I would be out for blood! So, what SHOULD have gotten Best Picture? The Emperor's New Groove! That is the simgle best movie dudes! Its refreashing, and totally random! Something tha deserves a lot more praise. Again, I could make a movie ten times better then CT, HD, and with moves so good a human could pull them off. Real life action, even if they are asian just doesn't cut it when your going for epic. Too many movies are better then CT, HD. If that is your fav. movie you got some major problems. Horrible movie. My friend told me it was ten times better then The Matrix, I came out thinking it was ten times worse! Burn that girl!

[Muzman]

I must come into bat for this film a little.
I loved it. Something very interesting on our western film landscape getting such big play like that; well it's bloody fantastic!
All you twits going one about "goodguys act like *this*, bad guys act like *that*" should just stick to stallone and Schwarzeneggar films from the eighties. You'll be fine.
The FX: well I thought they were good, but then again I'm used to Wuxia films. But really, you'd think after the Matrix more people would "get" the philosophy behind it. There is no Spoon. Dig? Or do you need a virtual reality world to accept that idea? Of course its unrealistic. It's a fairytale. Why would you look like you have weight when you don't?
I know you can't argue someone into liking a film (well, not often) or buying into its premises, but there are reasons for it being the way it was.
A classic, possibly the hype got out of hand, but a classic none the less. The impetuousness of youth, the regrets of age, love, honour, betrayal, fate. It's got everything baybee! That tree sequence will be one of my faves for a long time I think. Truly magical.
Luna's right though. If you want a killer, realist fight flick you can't go past Dao (The Blade)! The final fight scene gives me goosebumps every time. Sergio Leone goes to old China! (personally, I'd re-cut it and get rid of all that pointless narration, but hey...)

[ToastyKen]

Re: flying

I guess it helps to know the tradition of flying in these films. I mean, people flying in martial arts films is actually about as normal as superheros flying. It might seem really silly to see a superhero fly for the first time, but after a while, you get used to it. Same here. I'm not going to complain about people who complained about the flying. Maybe they genuinely didn't like it, and maybe they're just not used to it.

In any case, what I found really interesting is that Lee did something different with the flying. Instead of having it just be a "wow" thing, the flying had grace and elegance.

quote:

---

Originally posted by wayfinder:
When i was watching the flight scenes, i took them first as a metaphor for what was really going on (i don't know if they were intended that way, but it works)

---

(major spoiler warnings below!)
Exactly. In fact, I'm not sure whether this is haughty overanalysis or not, but a friend of mine pointed out that there were several scenes where the two older characters tried to prevent Jen from flying, pulling her down when she launched...

Excuse the high-school-english-essay analysis, but I'm pretty convinced that those scenes where explicitly intended to illustrate flying as a metaphor for freedom.. They want her to stay with her family and her society instead of skipping off to be a wanderer.

At the end of the movie, when she leaps.. she takes the biggest flight of all.. completely escaping from the society that's been holding her down..

or maybe I'm just ranting because it's 3am. :)

[Spooky]

I have to agree with those who like Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon, but I take it one step further and congratulate those who 'get it'. It's like two films myself and others thoroughly enjoy: Kundun and The Thin Red Line. Even though we may be the minority, we 'get it.'

To not like CTHD is your complete right. But to criticize it for things you do not understand and call it 'Stupid' is down right arrogant. Having Asian friends, I watched films they brought back from Hong Kong, Korea, and China. These films would change from one serious moment to a moment where two people jump in the air and start shooting fireballs or lightning at each other in a modern day time setting. To the open-minded film lover this is something new, refreshing, and interesting. To the close-minded individual, this is just silly. After talking with friends about how those movies play out and why characters do what they do, you gain an understanding and appreciation for the Asian films. Having been exposed to Chow Yun-Fat, Jackie Chan and his other Opera School brothers and John Woo before their North American invasion, I was more open to CTHD, and I'm glad so many are now more open to other films with unique and unusual action and stories than the North American Market is used to.

It is because of films like The Matrix, which I really like, that the general movie going public is starting to see unique new things in film not seen in the typical North American releases. The Wachowski's took the chance on showing sequences based on films and comics they enjoy that many don't know about and brought a whole new world of visuals for you and I to enjoy by keeping their minds open to new techniques. The Matrix wasn't the most revolutionary flick by any means, but the techniques it used, not oft seen by too many, presented them to a much wider audience.

And, if a character gets you so annoyed they must be doing their job right. Remember how we all hated Paul Reiser's character Burke in Aliens?

And if you look at it this way. I think the film is Ang Lee's way of saying to the audience.."Those who say you can't make a new traditional martial arts movie that is refreshing and unique are wrong." And possibly, he's taking back and using the original stories that influenced George Lucas and others.

Anyway, I enjoyed it, so did many others and I personally can't wait till I get my hands on the DVD!

[ May 09, 2001: Message edited by: Spooky ]

[Chris]

equivalent to crouching tiger fight scene

[travis travis]

I liked it.

Maybe I'm lucky in having heard all this negative stuff first. If I had only heard hype I would most probably be more critical.

Anyway - didn't find Jen annoying, she's interesting character, couldn't strike a deal with discipline, death was her master, madness, etc... really interesting. (plus cute)

the fights- roof top hopping was bit jumpy. fights themselves could be too much weapon on weapon for too long, but I don't really care... the pine forest stuff at the end kicks ASS

poeticness - I dig it. much better then that Hollywood sap, The Matrix.

I don't know, I find the whole of this movie pretty interesting. Not super-extraordinary, but just, well done. Nice.

+ Sub-title movies, foreign culture, adds a bit of having to allow yourself to reach out more anyway, without your normal critical bias's

+ I like the title. That was cool, the moment the guy was talking about them all being corrupt tigers and dragons, and they cleverly call it Crouching Tigers, Hidden Dragons, without having to use that in the movie

[ June 06, 2001: Message edited by: travis travis ]