[binder]

yes yes yes, i think i finally got it, if u think this is crappy, then damn, because i worked for aprox. 40 minutes, and got this, i just dont know where to go now. i thought the blood would make a cool effect, and yes i did this, alan tew did the sketch, but damn, this is a nice pic. my best work ever.






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-----{ Binder }----
--Idealy unknown--
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www.freakyhand.reload-software.com

[Plop]

i take it you are asking for compliments only?

[digital-ghost]

again Alan did the sketch?

[waylon]

You know, there's only so much you can learn by coloring in other peoples' sketches. You seem to practice drawing a lot, which is really good. But once you've done the same thing again and again enough times, you really don't learn much from it anymore.

Another thing you might want to try - which is a lot of fun, and can teach you a lot - is re-drawing photos. Not tracing over them, but completely re-working them from scratch. There's a lot you can discover about form, composition, and color that you just don't get when you're painting between somebody else's lines.

[Affected]

I can't even see it. It seems your server has problems.

------------------
Affected

Democracy is a lie

http://affected.xs.mw

[Chapel]

You aren't missing much Affected.. trust me. What do you need us for Binder? Looks like you already wrote the critique you wanted. In my opinion though you still have alot to learn about coloring. Everything you have demonstrated so far is just slightly better than coloring inbetween the lines. (by the way on a few pics you did go outside the lines) I hope you take all of this criticism from the forum and turn out something that shows potential. Right now you just look like someone doing a bad job at coloring someone else's pics.

By the way folks.. I don't like to bash people but I'm still waiting for Alan's email saying he is cool with this.

[Rinaldo]

Binder-
If you want your colouring to become an artform you will have to do a bit more than put some airbrush inbetween the lines. I would opt for flat colour asopposed to some slightly modeled fuzzy stuff. I don't know if you have done much reading of comic books but one of my favorites in the Witching Hour (drawn by Chris Bachalo inked by Art Thibert Writen by Jeph Leob and coloured by some person called Grant Goleash) It has very simple colouring which I find to be very pleasing. Mostly flats with a bit of modeling here and there, more to give contrast/texture than any real form. A few gradients in places. It is very simple but very effective. The actuial colour choices are the important thing here.
A lot of the sucess in my mind stems from the artists ability to draw for flat colour. Thibert and Bachalo's lines can be left alone with relative sucsess. And I thnk this is the case with Alan Tew as well. You must realise that there are different ways of drawing, some are more friendly to colouring than others. Some rely on colouring to bring them out while otheres are better off B+W. I think Alan's scetches are very good in that they can work both ways but I don't really think that you need to do all that much work on them in terms of doing extra drawing. The trick is to get some nice colours that work together and make sure that you do not destroy the readability. If possible enhance it. This is maybe more design than drawing. It is also probably a good way to learn what colours to use.
As it is I think Alan's drawing are doing the vast majority of work here. Ask yourself the question- Does the colour add anyhting? Does it give a mood or ambience? If not then why do it?

I would also tend to put a bit more emphasis on the fact that you are using other people's drawings. You don't have to but If I was doing some colouring I would use the word "colouring". It's a world of Interlecuial property rights out there at the moment. This sort of thing is very important. You may be covered but IMHO you are treading very closely to the red line by not emphasising at every posible point that they are not your drawings. If Alan Tew were any less of a nice guy I would imagine that you would not be granted the rights to use them for colouring practice.

L8r

[ceenda]

binder,

Imagine if Dhabih could fix the forum so that people's usernames did not appear anywhere on their postings.

They would be anonymous. However, I would still be able to go into a post and say "Woaw, nice one spooge!", "Still the art master, eh Fred?", "Awesome Loki!", "Amazing Danny", "Hilarious synj, if slightly disturbing...".

However, if was to go into your thread I would say "Hmm, Alan Tew!".

You see, people on this forum are identified by many things, but their style is certainly something that gives them away. I think you would ultimately be rewarded if you could contribute some stuff that you had drawn yourself. My stuff isn't that great - however, it's better than when I first started posting, and through the comments and crits people continue to give, I think my work is getting better.

There's no reason why you should feel you can't contribute your own work. There may even be art classes near you or evening classes, not to mention plenty of books - even on comic book art (I seem to recall Marvel had a good one).

Anyway...

[Chapel]

Here is a website to help you binder. Not only does it have links to tutorials for coloring, but it also has lineart that you can download to color. Now, wow us all.
http://www.comiccolors.com

[JayBee]

I promised myself I wouldn't post to one of these threads again, but damn, Binder's addictive

First I want to say that I can't see your image. I tried going to the source, but your server seems to be down - go figure.

So, anyway, from the intro you gave, and the title of the thread, I was feeling quite confident that there was some hope of an original work. Imagine my dismay when I find out that the image I can't see is just another colouring job.

Now, I'm not going to crit your work yet, for two reasons:

1 - as I said, I can't see it

2 - I'm not sure what you're trying to achieve. I mean, what is it that you want us to crit? Why are you posting to sijun?

Don't get me wrong, I don't mean "why are you here, go away", I honestly think you should ask yourself what you want to get out of your posts here.

If you want everyone to worship your art, then you've come to the wrong place. We've already got several demi-gods who post here, and unless you can beat Spooge's goodbursh (TM), you're not going to get much worshipping!

However, I'll credit you with more intelligence than that. I'll assume that you're here to try and improve your work. Well, if that's the case LISTEN TO THE PEOPLE WHOSE ADVICE YOU ARE ASKING

What do you want us to do? We've critiqued your colouring work, but you don't seem to be taking any of the advice, so what's left? We can't crit composition, we can't crit form, we can't crit anything except the colouring because that's the only thing you're doing! Once you start posting your own stuff, people will be able to help you improve.

And don't be so embarrassed! You don't have to apologise for your work. If it's bad, people will tell you that, and help you make it better. Nobody will make fun of you (this isn't a schoolyard you know), nobody will deride you, and people will even stop shouting at you if you just post something that is your own!

The ironic thing is that you've now gotten yourself into a ridiculously fortunate position. When you post a thread that says "Finally, something by ME", people will read it. People will read it and give you soooo much encouragement, cos we're a really nice stack of people, and we want to help you and improve your confidence.

You're high profile now. People will read your stuff, and will crit you more than the average newbie, so please, I'M BEGGING YOU - DON'T WASTE THIS CHANCE!

Take time out tonight. Sit down with a photo or something like Waylon suggested, and spend three or four hours trying to copy it as close as you can. Don't trace it! - the people here will spot it

Post the image, and see what crits you get. Then, act on the crits and post the new version. That's how it works. Keep it up like that, and you'll improve. There's no other way.

Final note - Everybody here (without exception) wants to help everybody else. Despite the reception you received, this is the most friendly forum it has ever been my privilege to visit regularly, and people will accept you. Just ask yourself what you want to get out of it, and you'll be welcome with open arms.

Right, I'm back to work now.

Look forward to seeing your style!

Here endeth the lesson

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. . : : j a y b e e

www.sketchboard.co.uk

[Jenn]

yeh well its a nive red cross in a white rectangle. i also agree with jaybee

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DarkChyld

[binder]

dude im not asking what u think about me, im asking what u think i should make for the background, and if u have anything to say talk to the www.sijun.com artist, i followed his tutorial. anyway thanks for the www.comiccolor.com guy

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-----{ Binder }----
--Idealy unknown--
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www.freakyhand.reload-software.com

[Rinaldo]

that you followed a tutorial means nothing. Stop getting all hot under the collar. Who are you refering to by "Dude". I mean what kind of response to you expect if you just get all stand offish. A lot of people gave you some good advice on your art in this thread. Spent a while typing it up and thinking about it. Don't expect people to give you any attention if you just jump into a flame war and ignore any advice you are given.
At least use names. we're not mind readers for christ's sake.
I don't think you deserve to be flamed every time you show your face, but why agrivate people so much.

You're developin a "me and them" attitude which will only cause trouble.

[binder]

hey everytime i make a post someone try to start a flame war, so i think i have a right, i mean all ive been asking for is advice, and all people keep on saying is go get a coloring book and shit, i am an artist, and i just started PS coloring, so i am still going to creat my art with or without your peoples help.

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-----{ Binder }----
--Idealy unknown--
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www.freakyhand.reload-software.com

[Jorge]

Hi all. I just thought to come in and tell you all a joke:

There's this guy in his car driving in the highway H5 and listening to the radio. Suddenly the radio program interrupts to give an important news bulletin. <<<Attention all drivers: there is one lunatic driving the other way in the H5 highway>>>
And this man exclaims: "What the...! Only one?! There you have another one! and another one! and another one!"

(This is translated to my crappy english from spanish, but I guess you can get it)

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Jorge

[This message has been edited by Jorge (edited September 07, 2000).]

[Guy]

haha.. thats a good one jorge

[JayBee]

err, still can't see that image BTW.

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. . : : j a y b e e

www.sketchboard.co.uk

[Sc00p]

"dude im not asking what u think about me, im asking what u think i should make for the background".

No...you didn't ask that at all.

But anyway.

Why is his right collar-bone facing upward? And why the line below his navel...does he have a zipper on his body? Also, the way the blood runs suggests his body is completely flat...which would be wrong.

Now I KNOW you may not be looking for critique, because obviously you love this, but you still should heed our small bit of advice, or posting on the forum is a moot point.

------------------
Rene Antunes
www.nytro.org
[email protected]

[HumanClay]

It's amazing how people like "binder" can publicly beam with confidence, and people like Micke/Joachim/Spooge/Fred/Francis/etc.. are incredibly modest and soft-spoken. I could waste my energy detailing all of the hundreds of things wrong with your image binder, but it would do you no good. As you see it, you're an artist. I'm not qualified to critique such a phenominal talent such as yourself.

[binder]

ok since you guys dont understand english very well i will ask slowly, what should the environment be in this picture.

now u know what u do, u tell me what u think the environment should be,



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-----{ Binder }----
--Idealy unknown--
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www.freakyhand.reload-software.com

[endrigan]

You need a boot to the head ..... yup


[This message has been edited by endrigan (edited September 07, 2000).]

[waylon]

Oh come on, Binder. Here you are, surrounded by tons of incredibly talented artists, and you're dismissing all of the incredible advice we can give you to ask "what should I draw"?

Ugh.

Make him standing in a forest.

[Rinaldo]

Do you even bloody well listen to what people are saying. You get advice and then you just have a fit and call people a colective "Dude".

WHO ARE YOU TALKING TO!!!!!!!!

If you are going to create your art witout our help then don't expect to get any. And more importantly don't ask. If you want help then take the friggin advice.

As for the BG. IMHO you should make a picture concept with a BG in the inital stages. If that pic is one of Alan's sketches then you can't really go and make a BG for it. It is going to look like this guy is pasted onto some paper cut out set if you try and make a BG around him.

Not everyone has flamed you here. You are just in such a defensive state of mind that you are seeing evey little bad comment as a flame. People are not going to tell you that you are good all the time. Some of the stuff in this thread is constructive critisism. even those who have flamed you have given advice that will help you in some way.

This is not a flame, I'm trying to give you some advice. None of it is needlesly insulting.

[ceenda]

[sigh]

Maybe spooge, Fred or Francis might want to start a newbies thread that could help as a starter for those who want to practice basic techniques.

I'm sure it takes time to learn about etiquette on the forums but maybe some people never learn...

quote

Quote:

so i am still going to creat my art with or without your peoples help.

Okay, that's fine, but don't post it here if that is your attitude. Most people on this board are keen to help but even the keenest people on the board are going to turn away if they feel they are going to be insulted every time.



[This message has been edited by ceenda (edited September 08, 2000).]

[JayBee]

After this I'm not going to reply to binder any more. He's clearly just an attention-seeking grade schooler with the manners of a spoiled infant (IMHO).

However, since I DO speak English, I shall reply to his direct request for advice:

quote

Quote:

ok since you guys dont understand english very well i will ask slowly, what should the environment be in this picture.

How about not the friendly, helpful environment of the sijun.com forums?

You clearly hate everyone here, and have no intention of taking any advice, so why do you keep posting? Are we the nearest thing you have to friends?

Go away until you grow up, or till your mum teaches you some manners.

And before you criticise other people's English, you might want to learn how to punctuate first...

IMHO.

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. . : : j a y b e e

www.sketchboard.co.uk

[binder]

you guys are still being retarded, fuck you alll, your all stupid, hahha, ill just figure it oput on my own, geez, next time when u are participating in these forums, you might want to talk more about the art, rather than how it was made, pr what my conduct is. not all artist are perfect little human beings, some are crazy, and some are just not paying attention to what is being said, i dont pay attention, because there is to many people saying stuff about me. i will still participate in these forums, but.. nm im going out now, cya

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-----{ Binder }----
--Idealy unknown--
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www.freakyhand.reload-software.com

[ceenda]

Wrong again, it's about basic manners... and you lack them.

This is my last reply to you.

[Chapel]

This is my last attempt to help you binder. The forum here is so that digital artists can have a place to come to learn from other digital artists and to be inspired to create more. The artist posts their work, the forum's talent critiques, they take those comments into consideration, and learn from them. Then they create more using what they have learned. You however are skipping one of those reasons.. learning. I'm surprised that the forum has actually treated you very kindly in giving you advice to improve. However, you give us the impression that you are above us all with your talent and that there is nothing you could learn from us. One tutorial does not make an artist. And if it is Dhabih's tutorial that you think you have mastered then you are sadly incorrect. If you think you have mastered your talent then maybe you should just move on, because there is nothing you will learn here.

Also, about the background to the picture...do you want someone else to draw that for you too?

[JayBee]

<JayBee loses it totally>

GUYS FOR F*** SAKE HOLD ME BACK - I'M GONNA KILL HIM! I'M GONNA KILL HIM

</JayBee loses it totally>

Ahem. Fine binder. You do that, take your art away from us retards where it will be appreciated. We're obviously too stupid to realise how utterly fantastic you are, so why bother wasting any more time with us?

No, really. Please take your art and your attitude problems elsewhere. This is a discussion forum, not a fight club.

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. . : : j a y b e e

www.sketchboard.co.uk

[FaithInChaos]

i've read all i can take...

binder, from my understanding had permission to use those sketches from the start. he has done nothing wrong, and all you guys give him is grief. so what if all he does is fill in the color, there are entire proffesions based on this. people color other peoples sketches for a living....ever read a comic book??

he might be a little cocky, but i do see his work improving. and the fact that someone feels good about what they do isnt a reason to put them down.
hes asking for help, and all you guys do is give him a cold shoulder and tell him hes a fake a rip-off artist and what he does is crap.

i guess everyone in here was born a masterfull artist, no one in here has ever colored over a photograph, and id be damn sure no one ever took their lips from spooges, dhabih, and freds ass to say something nice to a beginer.

i wonder if people read the posts they reply to...

"
yes yes yes, i think i finally got it, if u think this is crappy, then damn, because i worked for aprox. 40 minutes, and got this, i just dont know where to go now. i thought the blood would make a cool effect, and yes i did this, alan tew did the sketch, but damn, this is a nice pic. my best work ever
"

he gives credit you morons


i havnt posted any of my work in this forum, for one reason. i wanted to see what this forum and its members were like, although there are some great artists here i dont think i will be staying...people here act like they are two years old (and i am not talking about binder.)


binder: 40 minutes isnt a long time, i have spent weeks finishing a piece....
because you only have his upper torso, theres only a couple things i can think of at the momment. but i would put him in an industial setting with lots of rusted machines everywhere; pumps, gears, levers...ect.

anyways...
excuse my bad english and goodbye