[hennifer]

i just read a topic from sisko jr., where he said that leadership was lacking on this board. i don't exactly agree, but one thing has been on my mind lately, and i think it deserves a new topic.

this board needs an active moderator!

there are a bunch of people here who take on the role of 'mentors' as far as art goes. they post fair, encouraging messages, and try to help people out. we also need people with the same attitude to monitor the messages themselves.

in response to some inappropriate threads, i've seen comments like "as soon as dhabih goes away, this happens!" the fact is that dhabih doesn't seem to have time to monitor this board, and delete stupid posts/users. the flame thread from throbnicator should NEVER have been allowed to get up to 50-something messages.

i don't know about anyone else, but i don't think this can become "the best BB on the net" if nobody's at the reigns.

[Tinusch]

Word

[Frost]

I agree. I posted something like that a few months ago. Although, any retaliation or sign of control over some agressive, fed-up members might cause them to behave even worse than they generally do when we let them speak their minds.

[Affected]

I don't know... Deleting or closing flame threads would not solve the problem, it would just be swept under the mat. Maybe someone who would just move the irrelevant stuff to random musings would be a better idea.

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Affected

Democracy is a lie

http://affected.xs.mw

[Nex]

i don't see a need for a moderator here currently. Let people speak their minds as long as its in certain bounds.. We don't have really pesty spammers here now so I don't think its so urgent to have a control instance-

[This message has been edited by Nex (edited June 14, 2000).]

[Spiritwolf]

I agree with Hennifer in that a active moderator is a positive, not a negative.

The only problem is that a good and active moderator is very hard to come by, especially for a forum such as this. The person has to understand art, know the difference between hard critiques and antagonistic remarks, and most importantly have the time to devote to this place. A good moderator doesn't go around bashing people over the head for their commments, but trys to nudge threads into a postive direction before it gets out of control.

I know that a few people in here would be great for the job, but there is still that 'time' thing.

If any of the mentors on this board want to step forward and take the reigns as moderator then you would earn MY admiration (If that means anything to you).

'course, dhabih holds veto power over the idea, so it may never work anyway.

-Spiritwolf

[chalker]

I don't agree with the moderator, I don't think anyone can decide what to throw away or not.
And I think everyone has a right to say what they wanna say.
It's a free board let's keep it this way,

people who don't belong here will not stay long and people who think this board is cool will not be offended by those people.

I don't want anyone to filter the messages that maybe I wanna read, And what is the difference between a flame an constructive criticism ? where is the border ?

Some people say things in a offended way and they don't mean to, some people flame but they just critizize.

Look for the people you know, care for there comments, read flames as criticism and don't put it on yourself.

In real life or on the phone or television, there also isn't anyone who filters or decides what you will hear or watch..

decide for yourself..

My english is not to good, but I'll hope you understand.

[29A]

Censorship is the worst I know!

but I also agree that this board seems to need moderators, how about making a third board where all the flame/spam/useless posts go?
If you want to read that stuff, you have another board to check out...

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.sig
I'm not defect!

[Sedone]

What for? What would they moderate? I think this board seems to be doing okay. I've only been here a short time so maybe I'm missing something.

And what's your definition of "the best BB on the net"?

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http://sedone.cjb.net

[hennifer]

"the best BB on the net" was a quote from someone else.

as far as this belonging in random musings, maybe technically. but way fewer people read that. also, i'm quoting from messages posted on this section of the board. maybe this is a good example of why we need a moderator!

at any rate, interesting to see peoples thoughts about this. i still use that throbnicator post as an example. by deleting that, we're not losing anything, not censoring any artwork, and allowing ourselves to focus on what this board is about - art, not mind games.

personally i've always enjoyed bulletin boards (whether they be dialup or internet) when i know there's an active person in charge. in my experience a good moderator always makes a board better.

and about dhabih reading the board even though he's busy, he's mentioned a bunch of times that he HASN'T been caught up with the message threads. so.. that's that.

[Affected]

um... What throbnicator post?

[hennifer]

oops, frobnicate. here's the link:

*shudder*

http://www.sijun.com/dhabih/ubb/Forum2/HTML/002641.html

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hennifer

[Fred Flick Stone]

A moderator might work for some things, especially if it is just too damaging to the bb community. But as mentioned, I have seen Dhabih step in from time to time and cool off the heated posts brewing up...As for me, I feel that these threads are actually a good thing, rant or rave...as artists, we have it kinda fucked. Our work is all very mental, the ratio I have been told repeatedly is 10% physical, and 90% mental. I think I have experienced realizing this after many exhausting days behind the pencil(brush, wacom, whatever,)
We live in our heads, and when our client, our boss, our studio partner, mom, whatever, says anything about our work not being what they expected it, or could use improvement,etc. we the artist go a bit mental. Insult is the first thing to cross our path, then outrage, then arrogance, then dispondence, etc. The stronger suck it up, the weaker let it beat them down. We are mental creatures that don't have as easy a time releasing our frustrations, and these boards are like a great wall to yell at for a while, if that is our mental state. The only difference is that this wall has a voice to speak back, be it good or bad, praise or ridicule. This is to be expected, and the author of such rant is responsible for what was said, good or bad. The rest of us have the choice to read it or not, and respond.
AS I mentioned above, I feel a moderator is great for when a thread becomes a bit destructive for we the sensitive art types. But beyond that, I think its an anything goes scenario. Five years ago we wouldn't have this option to complain about these BB. Now that we are so fortunate to have such a wonderful outlet emotionally, why put all types of restrictions upon it. We are already restricted with rediculous laws and rules everywhere we go, this one little digital world of freedom may just be the only free world that we have left. That's really sad if you think about it, because someone could come along and just unplug it, then where would we be...

[kurisu]

dhabihnicator

I don't know. It's a tough call. My opinion would be to give everyone free cookies and call it a day.
I feel pretty strongly that freedom of speech is what this board is about. It's a place to share. Whether what anyone shares is appropriate for the 'Digital Art' forum is a hard call to make, too. Visibility can often be a prime motivator for those who want exposure, thus topics that one might consider "random" appear here.

There is an argument to the fact that, say, if someone or some people started to post what the majority considered indecent, that more people could join the board who share the interest in that indecent material thereby changing the atmosphere for those who liked it in the first place. How's that for a run-on sentence?

If I see something I don't like, I see having 3 options:

• Ignore it
  
• Comment on how I disagree
  
• Make a joke out of it - or see the humor in it.

I try to choose the third option because it is much easier to change my own attitude, than it is to try and change someone else's - so getting mad won't accomplish much, at least for me.

-kurisu

[kurisu]

And as far as leadership, Dhabih once replied to something I said about how the Gallery 2000 Thread was a pain in the behind because simple directions weren't being followed and it was a pain to keep it going, etc. etc. He said "just let it run itself." I think that is his philosophy about his forum. If you think about it, it's a perfectly logical and acceptable way. The life that this forum has was created by Dhabih, and then built up by its members. And this evolves constantly.

I saw all the ripping/threnodizing and photo reference debates/flames... and I think they bring up important issues - and sure some people got bent out of shape - but it gave those issues needed exposure.

Even Mongoose's sexist shinanigans... it helped bring to light the fact that behavior like that wasn't acceptable to many.

Also - what is acceptable and what isn't is purely subjective. One culture thinks burping and farting at the dinner table is okay - while another might finds it disgusting.

I think a moderator would just complicate the "mother nature" we have here - this community of people who share with each other and help things grow. A moderator could turn into more of a problem than he or she is worth.

One thing I think this forum could really use is an extensive FAQ, or at the very least, a better way to search and sort information. This is a difficult task, but if it could be done effectively, I think many people would benefit from others artistic talents, technical knowledge, technique, humor, ideas, etc. Now, searching for me is too much of a pain and I understand more and more why there are duplicate threads posted. So, somebody to spend time researching and implimenting this would be a good thing.

That's my abridged addendum opinion, anyway

-kurisu

[Thorn]

I'm agree with Fred. And Chalker and Kurisu, you both made good points, too. Everyone has, just thinking about it.

My feeling on the subject is that a moderator would need a very light touch in a forum like this. There's a lot energy, and sure, sometimes it erupts into flames. But often what sparks it off is an art issue that people feel VERY strongly about. Things like conceptual ownership etc. While I find outright aggression a bit confronting, I think to clamp down on what people are saying runs the risk of cramping legitimate art debate, as well as genuine critiques. What could also be lost is 'honesty'. By that I mean we end up with a forum where people are all very nice, there's little or no disagreement, and nobody puts forward their real opinion, they water it down to fit in with the group. In other words, the forum becomes 'conformist' in tone, rather than active, questioning, and 'real'. For me, personally, I would prefer to err on the side of free expression, even if it means I have to gird my loins when I post.




[This message has been edited by Thorn (edited June 14, 2000).]

[chrisk82]

Fred Flick - that was stunning

I can't seem to speak my opinion without becoming anal But anyways, Fred just read my mind and made it nicer

[chrisk82]

Creating another Board Room wouldn't solve anything. Putting in Moderators wouldn't solve anything. People will still post in Digital Art no matter if we have moderators or not.

I don't know how you can suggest adding in moderators when you do exactly what you want to deny other people. This whole post should of never been put in this forum, it should of been put in Random Musings.

I agree with Chalker in every way and form. Being a Free BB in a Free World, Adding moderators would more likely hurt this board than help it.

People should be able to say whatever the hell they want.

If someone wants to be nice and cheery, good for them. If someone wants to be harsh and cruel, good for them.

Everyone is entitled to speak what they want and how they want.

Being as Dhabih owns this board anyway, I don't think you'll achieve much as to attaining a moderator. Dhabih probably reads these boards even though he is busy. I'm sure if he sees something he doesn't like he'll stop it. I've seen it before with him and I'm sure he'll do it again. I think he has the best judgement for what goes or doesn't go, not the people who use it.

[This message has been edited by chrisk82 (edited June 14, 2000).]

[Slicer]

if there were more moderators there would be more deleted messages and for the spammers it would give them almost a kick of trying to get his/hers message to stay on as long as possible and they would spam more.
atleast what I think...