[mrCide]

Hey guys, I have a simple lil question for everyone. I know a lot of you are talented, and a lot of you are beginners (or claim to be ("my first drawing" cha-right)), anyhow, for those of you who draw human figures, did you all study books or take classes on muscle placement, and things of that nature? I mean, does everyone just *know* where to put things because they use to read comics when they were younger (or still do)? I've always loved doing things, specially in photoshop, but I've come to an interesting conclusion: I can't draw for sh!t. I learn all these new techniques, and I get the hang of doing things, shading, adding beat up fx to things, things I always wanted to learn, but damn if I have anything to apply it all to. So, tell me guys, what's the scoop? By the way, if you guys tell me that you studied some books on drawing, could you share which ones, maybe recommend something? Thanks a lot guys

[Funfetus]

If you happen to be in school, a figure drawing class would probably help. Otherwise, just go to a library or book store, and pick something up. There should be many books on figure drawing, perspective, anatomy, etc. Books I personally recommend are Burne Hogarth's "Dynamic Figure Drawing", and "The Atlas of Human Anatomy for the Artist" by George Peck (I think). And lots and lots of observation and practice.

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Funfetus
iCE VGA Division
http://www.funhousedigital.com

[Affected]

In addition to that, learn to think abou twhy the human form is the way it is. What purpose the muscles and bones serve, and how they will behave when moved. If you just learn diagrams, you'll hav a hard time adapting that info to anything.

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Affected
http://affected.cjb.net

[jasonN]

For me I've never taken any art figure drawing classes. I do art in school, but I'm only in the 10th grade. It's not like College classes or anything. I haven't really ever gotten a professional book, but once I picked up a cartooning book which was cool
But most of the time, everything comes from observation. Things you see in everyday life. And of course, comics. Comics are great because they have cool poses and you can see the way they've been coloured etc..
oh and this relates back to whether traditional skills affect digital results. I guess the answer is YES. Even if you know all these fancy techniques in photoshop, you need to know art fundamentals before you can create anything good digitally.
I think just observing things and sketching basic shapes will help a lot. It doesn't even have to be a sketch book, I probably leant most of my figure drawing by doodling in class....
-Jason

PS-oh and studying other people's work helps A LOT

[Affected]

That reminds me of something.. I've sort of noticed a lot of people taking a very systematic and mathematical approach to using Photoshop and other graphics applications. It's as if some people thought the program was going to do it all for them, but in reality it's just another medium. Sure, there are filters, but if you want to make something original, you'll need to use a lot of other stuff, too. There's no formula to making good graphics, although sometimes it would seem people expect there to be one, judging by all the 'how is this effect done' - posts. How often do you ask people who, say, paint with oils how they achieved some certain 'effect'?

There's a plus side to this, though. Since there's no 'make art' button, there are less limitations, as well. I believe that once people stop thinking of making graphics in terms of what techniques and steps you need to use to make an image, and instead develop your own ways of doing things, they'll have progressed a great deal.

Sorry to take this so off-topic.. :P

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Affected
http://affected.cjb.net

[Brain]

Books are good, and if you can find one of these figure drawing classes (never been or seen one in school yet), go for it. Options I've taken are books, looking at myself in the mirror (can't get enough LOL @;-), and of course, the most fun an art student can have, getting someone to model for you. Femmes love the attention. *grin* Uhhh...*cough* yeah.

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Brain
http://brain.gamekey.com/

[ka0z]

Books? wtf? You dont learn to draw from books. Maybe you can read about art history and shit, but you dont learn to draw from reading books. You want to get good drawing skills, get a notebook, a pencil go to a park or something and draw people. Drawing the human figure is essential, it holds so many possibilities and changes that its amazing. Everybody is different so draw everyone you see . fat people , skinny, old people, kids, even babies, everyone is different. Books are goods maybe to study some new/old techneques but the only real thing is practice and a lot.

[Funfetus]

Books are tremendously helpful for learning anatomy, perspective, composition, color theory, and whatever else. Remember, everyone learns differently. I definitely learned most of what I know from books.

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Funfetus
iCE VGA Division
http://www.funhousedigital.com

[SPike.CoM]

I agree with ka0z, but not all books are just history ka0z.
Find a way to practice a lot, books with nifty techniques will help you along the way but they are only hints. So be sure to pick up a papers and pencils and draw... A WHOLE LOT.

There are some books I got to recommend but I don't remember all of their names, I mostly borrowed books from the library.
However I got some here:
The DK Art School series. (Plenty of good books there).
"The Artist's Guide" by John Wilkinson is a good all-round one.
There are many more good ones which I don't know the title of.

Cheers and good luck.

[SPike.CoM]

Oh yeah, if you wanna learn anatomy fast, draw nude models.

Playboy and other magazines are a good source if you don't have the option to go to a "nude model sketching" class. No, I am serious.

[Judas]

I agree with what Affected said,
I sometimes go to the designs by mark
board and almost all those people want to
make things with photoshop but they all
think it's just pushing buttons and
bob's your uncle.
Some knowhow about photoshop is very handy
but your Creativity is what makes you a good
'artist' (i hate that word)

[ka0z]

Oh come on, you're not going to tell me that you learn composition and perspective, etc, from reading a book.. Of course, books are helpful in some way, but they wont grab a pencil for you and they wont trace the line for you. It all comes out of your mind/hand and through a _REAL LOT_ of practice

[Funfetus]

As a matter of fact, I did learn perspective from books. Composition is trickier, as I think it's something I already had a sense for, but books have helped me understand it more fully.



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Funfetus
iCE VGA Division
http://www.funhousedigital.com

[Mongoose]

ka0z,

Do you think we are born with preinstalled knowledge of perspective and anatomy? Maybe we got our knowledge from aliens? Like.. come on, you LEARN from books. No one claimed that books make you a better artist, but they can sure as hell help you achieve that.

It's common sense. We don't learn through osmosis.

/mongoose

[UberGnome]

Hold on a minute...you can't "LEARN" anything from a book, at least not to the full extent. Drawing is like any other art out there. Sure I could go grab a book on anatomy and read it but then can I say Im a doctor? lol

You learn things by actually DOING them. A book might help but you need to draw every day. Lemme give you a scenario here...You read a portion of a book, go try to draw what the book tells you to, and it turns out like shit. Why? Nothing is done right the first time, you have to do things over and over before it is done right. The more you draw the better you get, you cant go get a book, read it, and expect to be an expert artist.

'nuff said =p

[Funfetus]

No one ever claimed you don't need to practice. Several people, however, totally discounted the knowledge and insight that can be gained from reading.

You take two people who don't know how to draw. You put one in a room with a pencil, and you put the other one in a room with a pencil and a bunch of art instruction books. Who do you think is going to learn faster?

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Funfetus
iCE VGA Division
http://www.funhousedigital.com

[Jeezus]

yes, you CAN learn from books. is this some kind of war of the wits? hah.. like, proportion diagrams and stuff. an artist will begin to keep all that stuff in mind when drawing, therefor LEARNING from the book. i mean, this is commen sense. i cant believe it started an arguement

[UberGnome]

I know Funfetus I agree with you on that, notice I said books help...but you cant learn it all from a book.

[ka0z]

Mongoose:
It seems that you didn't full read my post. As I said books maybe are helpful regarding techniques and/or some tricks, but, again, as I said before they wont grab a pencil/brush and do the work for you. Take a person who reads only books about art and a person who only draws, and put them to draw a person. I highly doubt that the one that reads only books could even draw a straight line. Besides, I never claimed that you aliens gave us the knowledge. BUT, you ARE actually born with ability to draw greater that other people, its a little thingie called _talent_.. Hello, recognize that?
Anyway, books are some help, but the real and only thing is practice practice and more more more practice. Dont waste your time reading books about how to draw better, just DRAW and you'll be better. Even people that have no real ability can be better with time through a WHOLE LOT of practice.

[Affected]

A lot of studying has already been done on the psychological effects of colours,composition etc., so why re-invent the wheel?

[mrCide]

Hehe.. thanks guys I'm sorry I caused a lot of 'discussion' over all of this. I should of been more specific. I'm wanting to learn masculinity (right word?), of a male, shape of a women (combine to make a monster :P). I'm on my way to the book store now to look over and pick out some books *to help me learn*, not learn for me . Thanks for the suggestions everyone, I'll keep you updated.