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Topic : "Action against climate change" |
Max
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 Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 5:08 am |
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I got this email today!
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Action against climate change
Turn everything off on February 1st between 7:45 p.m. until 8 p.m.
On February 1st you can participate in the worldwide greatest action
against climate change!!! Various environmental organizations are asking
the peoples of this planet
to hold 5 minutes of "silence": Everyone should turn off all lights,
electricity etc. between 7:45 until
8 p.m. to bring attention to other inhabitants, the media and politicians
about the daily waste of energy. An act which takes only 5 minutes, which
costs nothing, but shows the governments that climate change should be on
the top agenda of world politics. Why this date? On February 1st the
United Nations is publicizing the newest results and knowledge base on
climate change.
SO.......TURN OFF!!! |
I definately will! |
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Sumaleth
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Mikko K
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| Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 5:32 am |
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That's what I thought as well 
I hope the e-mail didn't require sending money to Nigeria in order to participate  |
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Max
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| Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 5:56 am |
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| Well, I think they simply include the time people will need to take action. It's impossible that soo many people turn off the energy at the same time. Giving them 15 mins might give a nice overall result of 5 minutes peace. No? |
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iandredd
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| Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 6:15 am |
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| GMT? |
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Ranath
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| Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 7:21 am |
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it probably consumes more energy to switch things off and then restart everything, just like a car. Everytime you start a car up, you're wasting a coffee cups worth of gasoline  |
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Max
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| Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 9:02 am |
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lol  |
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Jimmyjimjim
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| Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 9:27 am |
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I know this doesn't sound related, but may be of interest.
A long time ago when gas prices were rising dramatically, I had an idea of how to stick it to the oil companies without trying to get people to not drive for a day (which, I'm sorry to say is absolutely impossible).
My idea was to boycot a different gas company every month, and make a schedual available on a website somewhere.
So, if you could get enough people to do it, profits would fall sharply for one month for each company, long enough and a big enough loss for the oil companies to panic.
Trying to get people to all turn off lights for five or fifteen minutes isn't going to happen (or mean anything). But what if people did something to stick it to them in their wallets where it really hurts? |
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fruity_loops
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| Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 11:16 am |
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Hmm, Jimmy, the only problem is that the companies will get everything they lost in the first month back in the next month, when another company is boycoted, because people are still buying the same amount of gas.
But I really like the idea of trying to change somthing yourself instead of blaming politics 
Getting a bike is probably not a bad idea! |
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Novacaptain
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| Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 11:19 am |
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maybe people could boycott all of the companies for 3 years at a time hehe...but in the end there would be only one left standing with total monopoly over the market.
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The Insane Lemur
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| Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 1:46 pm |
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| Ranath wrote: |
| it probably consumes more energy to switch things off and then restart everything, just like a car. Everytime you start a car up, you're wasting a coffee cups worth of gasoline |
hybrids cut off their engine when the car comes to a stop,then start back up when accelerating...maybe my sarcasometer isnt working today 
Anyways-what timezone? and how will the govs know the lights are off? |
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Ian Jones
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| Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 6:45 pm |
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| The Insane Lemur wrote: |
| and how will the govs know the lights are off? |
They'll freak out when the power station calls them saying we have an emergency excess of power... we have to shut down a generator or two. |
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Gort
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| Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 3:25 am |
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Not gonna do it; that's the charge time for my battery powered turtle neck sweater, and I also have no intention of cutting 15 minutes of Gilligan's Island out of my schedule - not for anyone.
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neff
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| Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 5:37 pm |
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As long they have no website, i'll do nothing.
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Ragnarok
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Diruo
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| Posted: Thu Feb 01, 2007 6:14 am |
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| Umm, I have a radical suggestion for them. Instead of shutting the tower lights down for 5 minutes, how about doing it permanently?! Jesus christ! The world needs to wake up ffs. Oh, and the UN report due friday looks fucking dire, from what I've read. |
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Gort
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| Posted: Thu Feb 01, 2007 6:39 am |
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Hmmm . . . I wonder . . .
"WASHINGTON, Jan. 30 /PRNewswire-USNewswire/ -- Two powerful new books say today's global warming is due not to human activity but primarily to a long, moderate solar-linked cycle. "Unstoppable Global Warming Every 1500 Years," by physicist Fred Singer and economist Dennis Avery was released just before Christmas. "The Chilling Stars: A New Theory of Climate Change," by Danish physicist Henrik Svensmark and former BBC science writer Nigel Calder (Icon Books), is due out in March.
Singer and Avery note that most of the earth's recent warming occurred before 1940, and thus before much human-emitted CO2. Moreover, physical evidence shows 600 moderate warmings in the earth's last million years. The evidence ranges from ancient Nile flood records, Chinese court documents and Roman wine grapes to modern spectral analysis of polar ice cores, deep seabed sediments and layered cave stalagmites."
http://www.earthtimes.org/articles/show/news_press_release,52394.shtml
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Diruo
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| Posted: Thu Feb 01, 2007 7:14 am |
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Sometimes Gort I'm not sure whether you're serious or just having a laugh. 
Anyway, I'm not going to argue on a subject where there is overwhelming scientific consensus.
I'm not familiar with the authors (except Henrik Svensmark, who I believe at least does legitimate science) but the wikipedia entry on Fred Singer made me laugh. |
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Ian Jones
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| Posted: Thu Feb 01, 2007 7:27 am |
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| Forget the science, forget the theories. It's just plain common sense that if we keep polluting and treating our world the way we are then eventually things are going to turn bad. Nobody in the world can deny that. |
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Gort
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| Posted: Thu Feb 01, 2007 10:12 am |
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| Anyway, I'm not going to argue on a subject where there is overwhelming scientific consensus. |
Actually there is not a consensus on the cause of the present day climate changes. In order for there to be a consensus, the scientific methods for drawing the conclusion have to be replicated with the same results from the methodology. Believe it or not, there are climatologists that disagree with the popular belief that fossil fuels are the main cause.
I am not saying that there are not climate changes, but what I am saying and from an objective viewpoint, is that there is no consensus on the cause. Now before you hammer away, let me state that I am a staunch environmentalist and as green as they come, and I accept the fact that artificial means can and do have dire repercussions on our world, but I also like to think that I am objective when it comes to science - or cynical .
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Diruo
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| Posted: Thu Feb 01, 2007 10:58 am |
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| Believe it or not, there are climatologists that disagree with the popular belief that fossil fuels are the main cause. |
They are one in a thousand. This has been so incredibly misrepresented by the media, even here in Sweden. Understandably, I guess, for when there is a debate you want to air both sides, giving the impression to the public that there are two equally popular opinions. And 10 years ago there was indeed a serious debate, still. But the number of scientists that do not believe that the causes are anthropogenic (and that does not have ties to industry) have dwindled and been made more or less non-existant by overwhelming evidence and new data.
I'd say that the few that were serious and had an alternative theory have caved in. I took a closer look at the work of before-mentioned Henrik Svensmark and he has received a fair share of critique and has been accused of bad methodology and misrepresentation of data.
If you're interested, here is some of the debate:
Henrik's papers: http://www.dsri.dk/~hsv/
Critique by Peter Laut: http://stephenschneider.stanford.edu/Publications/PDF_Papers/Laut2003.pdf
Henrik's retort: http://www.dsri.dk/getfile.php3?id=290
Peter's comments on retort: http://stephenschneider.stanford.edu/Publications/PDF_Papers/Laut2003a.pdf
Pretty interesting... though note that Henrik's papers are now rather old. I'd be surprised if he still holds with the views.
Damn you for wasting my afternoon Gort!
Edit: Cleaned up. Was rushed due to the fact that I felt compelled to shut everything off at 19:55 . I don't think I made it. |
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Gort
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| Posted: Thu Feb 01, 2007 11:52 am |
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One in a thousand? I'm not so sure of that. I would say show us the numbers and data on that one - unless one just wants to concede to a generalized popular belief. Show us the data.
How are you so sure that the popular belief isn't rack with bad data itself? Where are the control mechanisms? Have the methodologies for the popular belief of the causes been replicated with the same conclusions? Who are the scientists that came to these conclusions? Better yet, who funds their research and how do we know they're not just telling me, you and their financiers what we want to hear? Can you declare to the world truthfully and beyond the shadow of a doubt that this "overwhelming consensus" operates without any shred of bias or influence?
The question I propose (and this is highly relative to another thread involving prejudices towards Americans) how do you know you're getting the whole picture? The straight dope?
Ah I am such a cynic.
Now let me continue to reiterate that I am fully convinced that the world has issues with pollution through emission (and other means, such as waste water, etc) - that isn't an argument with me. It's just when it comes to science, I refuse to accept what the talking heads and their editorial staff want me to read and see as the gospel, when they make no effort whatsoever to show control studies or other countering arguments. That's really what it boils down to - for me.
While you cannot read the inflections of my thoughts, please take some comfort in knowing that my tone and stance is meant to be respectful and with the utmost consderation and diplomacy towards your view. Oh yeah - sorry for wasting your afternoon!
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Impaler
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| Posted: Thu Feb 01, 2007 12:00 pm |
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Did anyone say the Straight Dope?
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QED, sort of. |
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Gort
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| Posted: Thu Feb 01, 2007 12:12 pm |
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We've been Impaled!
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Diruo
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| Posted: Thu Feb 01, 2007 12:58 pm |
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| Quote: |
| One in a thousand? I'm not so sure of that. I would say show us the numbers and data on that one - unless one just wants to concede to a generalized popular belief. Show us the data. |
Ok, fine, I admit, it was a estimate based on... umm... heh... gut feeling. But I study physical geography, you see, and our lecturers on climate and meteorology really has emphasized how rare disagreement on this issue is at the moment. None Swedish, I think (and we have quite a few climatologists).
But fine! I'll take the challenge. Not much time. Must sleep. This is the best I can do:
http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/full/306/5702/1686
928 abstracts of peer-reviewed papers studied. 700 on topic. 0 disagreed. Granted, these are papers, not people. And 0 out of 700 isn't 1 in a 1000, but still!
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| The question I propose (and this is highly relative to another thread involving prejudices towards Americans) how do you know you're getting the whole picture? |
I use my omniscience!! YES! I SEE IT NOW! Seriously though, you live inside a bubble in America (yes you do, yes you do, yes you do... x10). Too much reliance on domestic media, I say! Media tied to industry! But now I say I must sleep! YES! SLEEP!
(I need it, clearly) |
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Gort
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| Posted: Thu Feb 01, 2007 1:22 pm |
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LOL! It's not so much a challenge for you but for us all. Someone once said "question everything", and I often do.
We all live in bubbles, really. Reading the "American Thread" had me cracking up, because I'm reading a lot of impressions that the rest of y'all are getting and drawing conclusions on about us Yanks, and it can only come from what you read or see on news, etc. Hopefully Jimmy (ahem! ) will give us the go ahead and engage.
Sleep well, laddy.
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