[[Shizo]]

All religions have belief in souls, even anti religions like satanism hehe, otherwise religions cant exist because ther's gotta be a promise of life/existance after death or people wount worship it. So!
At what point, exactly, does sould "attach" to a body? Is it enbryo, sperm, where? You religious whorez! I got yo! Cause there isnt soul.
But it wount matter because all remory comes from body "interacting" with world. You learn how to walk and talk, you learn about religion (!). When you died, the soul would have to be completely blank because it wouldnt know what earth is, or people, or anything. So when you put soul into this, it doesnt work - therefore all religions r fake!
hahahahaa i win, i found an answer to all questions in universe Weeeeee... worship me

[Dr.Squirley]

not all religions beleive in certain after death conceptions.

[edraket]

Somehow you sound like FLAT.
It's very hard to follow.

I agree with Dr. squigly btw.

[wayfinder]

if you were to accept the existance of a "soul", the moment when sperm and egg unite to form a single, coherent DNA double helix might be a logical point of forming it, because that's where things get unique.

[edraket]

People that are under hypnosis and being regressed experience that point as the point where they entered their body.

Ok..go ahead and laugh at me. I just thought it was a fun little fact to mention.

[klaivu]

If you want to know what happens after you die, go look at some dead things.

[Basse_Ex]

If you wanna know what happens when you die, there's only one thing you can do:

Go and die.

(Although this isn't recommended).

It's funny how some atheists are always "out to get" religious people. There isn't anything to "get", as such. Either you got it, or you don't. Remember the most important, and most forgotten, qoute in the Bible:

God moves in mysterious ways.

Some things we will never know. It's a fact of life. Now stop sounding as silly as a born-again christian, and start making some sense.

Please?

(You silly, silly person).

[klaivu]

So how am I out to get you ? I felt like I was merely stating my opinion on the matter ..

[travis travis]

get over this religion crap, and study non-religious people's paranormal experiences. then tell me that life operates like a walking, talking piece of meat. that's ridiculous. we are powered by an energy we understand very little about. YOU CAN EXPERIENCE it for yourself. The fact that you haven't suggests to me that you're a fundamentalist, a reductionist, unaware, or just plain lazy - but that does not excuse you. Or to put it in nicer terms - your belief system is based on nothing at all, how can you base your existance around not experiencing? The words atheist and religion both suggest extremely close-minded people who lead very closed lives.

It's hard for me to slam people for this, because I understand that society does not grow open minds. Typically only people who've had a lot of time alone in life are privy to that sort of beautiful freedom and truth and an ever questioning mind. And the so-called normal people herd into sub-cultures for a sense of well-being and attack any other sub-culture that threatens that. Understandable, it's how society works. But to me, having lived the observant life instead of the integrated, no-brain life - it's just sadly ridiculous how much personal reality and meaning is lacking when people get into arguments about spirituality.

[edraket]

Amen
although you are generalising a bit I think.

[SolarC]

I'm standing on pretty same grounds with travis travis in this issue.

[klaivu]

quote:

---

Originally posted by travis travis:
get over this religion crap, and study non-religious people's paranormal experiences. then tell me that life operates like a walking, talking piece of meat. that's ridiculous. we are powered by an energy we understand very little about. YOU CAN EXPERIENCE it for yourself. The fact that you haven't suggests to me that you're a fundamentalist, a reductionist, unaware, or just plain lazy - but that does not excuse you. Or to put it in nicer terms - your belief system is based on nothing at all, how can you base your existance around not experiencing? The words atheist and religion both suggest extremely close-minded people who lead very closed lives.

---

I've yet to see any validity to any of the mass of 'paranormal experiences' you mention. If you hear Jesus talking to you, there's medication for that these days.

I see no need to explain my existence with the duality of soul and body, if that's what you mean. Your brain works pretty much like a computer, controlling the rest of your body, interpreting your perceptions, storing your memories and processing data, ie. thinking. How about you looking through some psychology and biology books ? Your brain is capable of doing pretty amazing tricks on you ..

We are powered by an energy we understand very little about ? So what is this mystic energy you talk about ? Care to elaborate more ? I'm kinda curious.

btw, I feel that some people are offended because my opinion is different from theirs. Is this so ? I realize this is an emotional issue ..

[edraket]

I am not offended. If you believe you are a corpse that just hasn't started rotting yet thats your problem not mine.

[Unsound]

*lol* There is another religious discussion breaking off from the original.

OK, about the soul…

In the Bible, “soul” is translated from the Hebrew ne'phesh and the Greek psy�khe'. Bible usage shows the soul to be a person or an animal or the life that a person or an animal enjoys. To many persons, however, “soul” means the immaterial or spirit part of a human being that survives the death of the physical body. Others understand it to be the principle of life. But these latter views are not Bible teachings.

Gen. 2:7: “Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul.” (Notice that this does not say that man was given a soul but that he became a soul, a living person.)

1 Cor. 15:45: “It is even so written: ‘The first man Adam became a living soul.’ The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.” (So the Christian Greek Scriptures agree with the Hebrew Scriptures as to what the soul is.)

1 Pet. 3:20: “In Noah’s days . . . a few people, that is, eight souls, were carried safely through the water.”

Gen. 9:5: “Besides that, your blood of your souls [or, “lives”; Hebrew, from ne'phesh] shall I ask back.”

Josh. 11:11: “They went striking every soul [Hebrew, ne'phesh] that was in it with the edge of the sword.”

“There is no dichotomy [division] of body and soul in the O[ld] T[estament]. The Israelite saw things concretely, in their totality, and thus he considered men as persons and not as composites. The term nepe_s [ne'phesh], though translated by our word soul, never means soul as distinct from the body or the individual person. . . . The term [psy�khe'] is the N[ew] T[estament] word corresponding with nepe_s. It can mean the principle of life, life itself, or the living being.”—New Catholic Encyclopedia (1967), Vol. XIII, pp. 449, 450.

“The Hebrew term for ‘soul’ (nefesh, that which breathes) was used by Moses . . . , signifying an ‘animated being’ and applicable equally to nonhuman beings. . . . New Testament usage of psych_e (‘soul’ ; ) was comparable to nefesh.”—The New Encyclop�dia Britannica (1976), Macrop�dia, Vol. 15, p. 152.

When the life force stops sustaining the human body, man—the soul—dies.

[ April 12, 2002: Message edited by: Unsound ]

[SolarC]

Klaivu,

I can speak only for myself here, but what I feel is that there are quite many energies which keep us humans going and they don't have to be necessarily anything "out of this world" kind of things. If I understood correctly what travis was saing was to keep an open mind on these things, because there are much spiritual, emotional etc. things we can't fully understand yet and maybe never will.

I think it is important to just focus on the essential and live our lives, emotions and spirituality, no matter are they in the end coming from our brains, god, soul, mother nature, pope or George W. Bush. It is just a waste of time to argue about these things and make up some explanations of where these things are coming, while the important thing is these things exist no matter what they exactly are.

This is why I feel religions can be so corrupting, because it is so common that religion only offers explanations which may or may not be true and give some rules which alienate people from really living their lives and make them unable grow mentally. From this point of view Atheism can be just as bad as any religion if it's used for saing spiritual and emotional things does not matter.

To make it short I think the more important thing is to gain from the things what we have, live our lives, all parts: love, sorrow, fear etc. and learn about ourselves, our values and invest in our mental/spiritual growth.

[ April 12, 2002: Message edited by: SolarC ]

[Basse_Ex]

Klaivu: Uhhh... sorry... I wasn't addressing my post to you... it was meant for the topicstarter [scizo]... I wasn't telling that you were out to get me at all... sorry for the misunderstanding.

[Giant Hamster]

Stop talking about me already. Shit man.

Even I, God, get tired of hearing your whining. None of you are correct!

Why don't you believe me? I though you said you follow me blindly without question, etc, etc because I move mysteriously, etc etc, I am all powerful, you know the writtings. What the hell happened to your faith and belief in me?

Suddenly you don't believe in me while at the same time you're trying to talk about me as though you know me better than well, me?

[Unsound]

I didn't know God's name was JameZ ...

[Coaster]

For me I just stand muttering in disbelief about how people can beleif in this supernatural B.S.

[[Shizo]]

HEhehe JameZ is dah Gawd, i am his Apostle. We take rocket launcher and if you dont believe in his mysterious ways we take your head away.

Actually i'm right, maybe later i write a book or somethin, but it wount matter cause NOTHING REALLY MATTERS and you're just a bag o' bonez.

[Unsound]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Coaster:
For me I just stand muttering in disbelief about how people can beleif in this supernatural B.S.

---

Well, look at it this way: Most people want to live a generally happy life, so they find things in life to make them happy. Religion is one of the few things in my life that I actually feel good about doing. I have much anxiety and despair, so it has also helped to make my life seem less worthless. In a lot of ways it is hard to explain, but it makes me happy nonetheless. If it didn't make me feel good, would it make sense that I stick with it?

[ April 12, 2002: Message edited by: Unsound ]