[Kagri]

Hello, that's me again!
I have a problem with the picture: I need to change the face to make the pic look like a different person... But when I just change the shape of lips, or face, or eyebrows, it starts looking rather like a parody on this one than a different person. So I was wondering, WHAT should I change (and preferrably how ) to make her look different, yet no worse than now. (Different as in, so that when you'd look at it you wouldn't have fast accossiations with this version). Sounds pretty impossible, hmm. It's just that I don't wanna completely re-draw it, cuz it came out so nicely...

[aphelionart]

do you hav any examples of previous attempts? how does it look like a parody.. to alter a likeness i'd focus on the nose first, maybe her cheek/bone structure, lips, and eyes..
-matt

[Sorry]

Shes Crossed Eyed You Should fix that first...

[Kagri]

Here's the pic where I tried to change her lips, eyebrows, and the line of the jaw.



It doesn't look too unnatural or anything, even that the jaw is so roughly shaped, but the original one seems just so more more natural.

Sorry, the thing is that I'm painting it, while looking at a digital photo, and there the eyes are pretty much the same strange way. If you mirror it it doesn't even seem unnatural, but I agree it's strange... so in the next version I'll try to do smth about it.

[Kagri]

Oh well, I couldn't really make any worthy changes, so I just left it be... Any crits?

[Sorry]

Much much better kagri

[Kagri]

Heeeh, thanks!! I've found an amazing option in the menu - Curves. If you play with it you really can change the whole look of the picture.

[Sorry]

Cant Wait For The Final Draft Man..

[Kagri]

Well, actually, that's already it. At least, I dunno what else I should change... Do you think it looks way too unfinished?

[Sorry]

ya..She Dont have smooth Skin

[aphelionart]

hey kagri, don't know if this is too late or not what you meant, but i did a quick paint-over to give some ideas.. definitely not as attractive and the features could definitely still be pushed much more, heh.. i think for a different likeness, you'd be better off painting over features rather than simply transforming them, because different features would also affect how the light is being reflected off the face.. mm i didn't do such a great job but try seeing the features in 3d space, imagine where it could go (say on another person) and then block in shadow/light of the new feature.
-matt

[Kagri]

Wow, aphelionart! She DOES look like a completely different person!!! Pretty cool! Especially the nose makes it all change, but I guess now she'll be looking better with blak hair, cuz her type of face just changed in such a way. But I kinda wanted to draw a young girl, and she looks like older woman in my eyes...
Anyways, you're right of cuz with the features - it's better to draw them differently right away, the fact is that it's my first picture, where I used a digital photo of myself for referrence, and I had some probs with nose and the way the whole face looked, so I first tried to "build" it the right way, and then already change the features (hair and eye colour I made different from the start). But when I was about to radically change features it came to be much harder then I thought.

But thank you VERY much for your overpaint, I'm always too afraid to just paint the nose COMPLETELY over like you did to give it different shape (afraid cuz maybe it'll stop looking naturally ), but this idea of yours (putting the tip of the nose down so much) I can use in my next pic, heh. I'll definitely be doing more of them and each time will have to think of somthing else.

Oh, and Sorry: I see what you mean, but I kinda like it this way. Normally I make all the pics way too smooth and perfect, so it's good for a change.

[aphelionart]

yea, no problem... if you really wanna get more out of this, check out http://www.fineart.sk/index.php?cat=14 ... andrew loomis's book on head and hands, and he's got lots of good examples in there

-matt

[Kagri]

Wooh, thanks!!! I bought myself a nifty book on anatomy, but they don't focus very precisely on faces, mosly just on the body itself, and here's just an amazing collection!

[aphelionart]

also i like burne hogarth's book on heads too if you happen by the bookstore again. him and loomis can teach you everything you need to know about the figure

-matt

[Matthew]

hey Kagri.

I made this overpaint the day before yesterday and I wasn't gonna post it but since you were helpful and all earlier I thought I could post it for you. Will probably be the last in the line of overpaints from me in this forum so I hope it will help.

Sometimes a picture can be helped by exaggerating the contrast and brightness, not always, but what I saw in this particular picture was that I think it would be helped by pushing the values. When painting a face it is good to have a mix of hard, medium and soft edges to give depth, don't think I pulled if off in this overpaint though but maybe u get the idea. The nostril for example is darker and that makes the edge in front of it a hard edge. I have put a lot of thinking into edges lately and with this u really can help the depth.
Also play with the light on the face, I added white dots in the places that can be exaggerated and with different light-direction these becomes shadowed, hmm can't explain that further though but look into books with different lit faces and memorize those. I still have a lot of work to do with faces aswell and it is an eternal struggle to paint them without ref and remember all the rules and different approaches, maybe someday I will master it.

once again I hope it helps and keep up the good work, something in your work that really gives me inspiration. I like that face above with orange hair so this overpaint is only to give some tips.



have a nice day
Matthew

[Kagri]

MATTHEW!!! WOW! You know, I'd never ever, never ever guess it's an overpaint! And she doesn't look any worse, just so... completely different! There's something in her that just attracts... maybe the way her lips are a tiny bit opened? I LOVE how you did the eyes and the nose - especailly the way you worked on with the pen on the nose is amazing, like if it's a pencil. Really, you made a completely different work of it! I so wish I could do the same! And also I think it's cool the way her lips look - like if she uses a lip gloss!

But why is this your last overpaint?? You're doing a great job there!
And if it's the last one on this forum, are there maybe other forums?? I'll just have to follow you there.

P.S. I'm currently working on a pic of my husband - wanna make him a bit bandit-like, hehe! I've found out for myself that it's much easier to do all the job in black and white first, and then colour the pic, but I guess it'll never come out as bright and alive, as you do it. So hmm, I'll just have to see what'll come out - I am doing the pic of my husband this easy way... but I hope I can use some of your tips to make it look more alive and interesting! Thanks!