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Exoudeous · Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2003 12:53 am

I Know I made a topic before that stated i was buying a vaio, but now im not to sure what to do. I had changed my mind and was gunna get a mac, but I realized that i would then have to get mac versions of photoshop and painter, and I dont have enough money to do that. So I decide to go back to PCs now. my question is is a Vaio a good choice or is there a better comp i can get to do graphic work on? I got $1,750 to spend, and thats for both the comp and monitor.

Once again, thanks for you help.
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B0b · Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2003 5:03 am

u gonna play games on it as well?

liv the fish · Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2003 9:24 am

I use a VAIO at work to produce in-house DVDs of our commercials. I just finished backing up thousands of commercials we had on VHS in DVD format. Needless to say, I've worked with this machine for several hours and I'm very happy with it. It's powerful, fast and stable. I've never had any freeze ups, crashes or blue screens. It runs on XP. I'm not sure what the other specs are but I could find out if you want. I haven't done any digital painting on it, but for what I have done, it's worked amazingly well. If there any issues with VAIO products, I haven't encountered them yet.

You might want to consult B0b on this one. I've found his technical knowledge to be very complete and helpful.

my 170000 cents,
Brian
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Exoudeous · Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2003 9:31 am

bob- Im not a big Pc gamer I am a console person, then only way id play video games on my comp is if i got the vaio with those nifty s-video ports.

As long as I can work productivly in photoshop and painter, while listening to my mp3 collection, Ill be sound as a pound.
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bearsclover · member Member # Joined: 03 May 2002 Posts: 274

Well, the porting over from PC and having to get Mac software is a big problem, I'll admit. That might be enough right there to put you off Mac.

However, you could sell your PC software (on eBay, if possible) and transfer your license over to the new owner. Adobe allows this. You'll probably get 50-60% of the full price (or more--it's just a guess) for these programs, but it will help pay for new Mac versions of these programs. And, you could always look for eBay bargains on Mac software. I got both Photoshop and Illustrator (and Painter, and Flash, etc. etc.) off of eBay for a low price. All legal, registered with Adobe, and Corel. You have to be patient and wait for the good deal to come up, but usually I spend about 50-60% of full price on software on eBay. (And I repeat--all legal, all registered with the software companies.)

If you are willing to sell your PC software, etc., and you are leaning towards Mac in the first place (and it appears as if you aren't into gaming) then I say go for the Mac. The new G5s are supposed to be pretty nice. I love my G4 running OS X (Jaguar) and I prefer using Photoshop with it. (It's just my personal opinion, but I also use a very nice XP machine and IMO, Photoshop is "clunky" with it. Partly it's because I'm used to all the Mac PS shortcuts, but it's more than that too. That's just my opinion.)

Also, playing MP3s on the Mac is great. I love iTunes. I haven't seen anything on the PC side that compares. (I've given up looking.) Of course, iTunes comes out for Windows eventually, but my point is, MP3s on the Mac are great.
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cheney · Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2003 5:46 am

If you are a serious digital artist you will build your own system and understand why certain hardware is more important than other hardware.

For Photoshop keep these in mind:

1) Your primary concern should be fastest possible data storage bandwidth.
2) Your secondary concern should be largest possible CPU cache.
3) A very distant third should be CPU clock speed.
4) Pick your video card for highest possible crisp resolution output at the highest possible vertical refresh. Videocard speed, 3D processiong, GPU power all mean nothing except for gaming and a tad bit for 3D rendering.

With that in mind I suggest waiting for two or so months until Intel releases their Prescott chip. Then at this time the cost of a Xeon cpu should drop. I always suggest building a multiprocessor (SMP) system for Photoshop workstations. Windows is extremely more stable on a (SMP) system because it uses a modified kernel. Photoshop also has brilliant multi-threaded design. So brilliant that it uses effectivly 70-75% primary thread and whopping 20% secondary thread processing. The only thing Photoshop does not have down in this regard is operation across multi-threaded CPUs on a (SMP) system, because the software would regard this as quad-threading. But, Photoshop 8 just might correct this and its supposed to be out around Christmas or early next year.

Currently Xeon CPUs are using an older 533mhz bus only 1mb of cache. So, I would wait until early next year when they will be bumped to a 800mhz bus with possibly an extra 2mb of level3 cache.

If you are truely interested in buying a system to perform for Phototshop you will read my essay here. It was clear at that time that Mullins had done a bit of homework on this subject as well, perhaps more than anybody else on this board. But, my solutions was a bit expensive for him (my solution is very expensive, but still the best way to go). So, about a year or so I posted my essay he built a system using a 15krpm scsi disk array at Raid0, and would merely backup his data to disk each night. Nice alternative, but still expensive.

And, check out these sweet pics of my watercooled dual-Xeon system here:
http://www.createdbycheney.com/cpu1.jpg
http://www.createdbycheney.com/cpu2.jpg
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Exoudeous · Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2003 12:52 pm

Here are the specs so far of the Vaio pc im building online:
Intel Pentium 4 Processor 2.60C GHz with Hyper-Threading Technology
1 GB DDR SDRAM
160 GB (7200 rpm) Hard Drive
nVIDIA� GeForce� FX 5200 (128 MB) Graphics Card
Optic Drive #1 24x CD-RW
Price=1403

Monitor from Veiwsonic store
19" (18" Viewable) .25mm Beige 2048x1536 PerfectFlat UltraBrite CRT Monitor [Refurbished]
Price=169

tell me what you guys think
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liv the fish · Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2003 7:23 am

If you have the money, I'd recommend a DVD-RW instead of the CD. DVD writers are getting cheaper by the minute. I believe all DVD writers can also write CDs if that's an issue (or at least check with the vendor that the one you want does). The higher storage compacity is well worth it. I think some people might suggest 2 Hard Drives as well, but you may be ok with one and a few partitions. I wouldn't get a refurbished monitor unless it had a warranty. I got a cheap under a hundred and it clunked out in less than a year. I learned my lesson. I'm not familiar with Video card specs, but I think people might have lots of heated things to say about that Smile

later,
Brian
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Exoudeous · Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2003 9:34 am

Well I found teh same moniter new for 279, so im not gonna get teh refurbished one.

bearsclover - Id love to get a mac, but even with discounted software, I wouldnt have enough, I need a comp like now. Im going to Art School starting October 1st. and If I really need a mac, I can just use one in one of the new G5 computer labs. And anyways, without having enough to fully upgrade the mac, it wouldn't be as good as I could get cheaper with pc constructed for me.

cheney - Thanks for all teh info. What do you think, of the specs of what I got so far? Id like to wai t for teh new procesors, but as well as being a digital artist, I am An art Student at The Illinois Institute of Art - Chicago. And like I said, school starts in less then a month. And it would be nice to have A computer When I start, along with having all my software installed before I get there. And since ALL my money is going towrds school as well as what ever I earn from jobs, I have a 1800 limit for now.

liv the fish - I wish I could Get a DVD-RW now, but it would cost like 150 more, plus DVD-RW disks are still kinda costly. I could Always get one later on if I need it, But I dont expect to fill the HD fast enough to need it anytime soon.

Thanks for you time peoples
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Drew · Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2003 2:34 pm

I wouldn't worry so much about school coming up. I've been in school studying animation for a bit over a year and my PIII 500 is holding up fine. I'm just now getting to serious 3d modelling and will probably need to upgrade very soon, though. You'll probably start off with basic stuff for the first year, with very little computer work. Do you have a list of the courses you'll take? You can ask around and see when it would be best to buy a new box.

Also, if I had that budget and needed a monitor and was going into digital art, I wouldn't get anything other than a 19" Sony. Colors on other monitors die way too early. My monitor is several years old but still very bright.

Exoudeous · Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2003 7:05 pm

Drew - I am majoring in Web design/Graphic design, So I will need my comp this early. And Since I live in the City, The apartments they gave us, are not to close to the school (we have to take a CTA train to get there) I dont feel like having to go down to use the libary comp all the time.

And since Im paying for college myself, money will be tight for me, so I need to get this computer when I have money to spare.
I dont need a powerhouse computer. that can wait for when I graduate and become professional. I just need somthing that will last me 3 years considering ill be doing lots of graphical and web work.

Thanks for your time
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cheney · Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2003 8:31 pm

Of the specs you have so far....

I think you are mostly in the right direction if you don't have the money to build a power machine. I would actually save up the money to get 2gb of ram. It will make a huge difference if you want to work on large images for print.

I also recommend getting a DVD burner as liv the fish stated. I have one and it was well worth it. As far as this goes get a newer Sony model, because they will burn to any of the 5 types of DVD disks. If you want to save money and get a cheaper model I suggest getting a DVD+RW (different than DVD-RW).

Finally, somebody recommended two seperate hard drives. I completely agree that this is a huge area of importance. Hard drives can and do sometimes crash. So, I recommend buying an extremely fast smaller drive to use as the software installation drive, and a larger slower drive as the data dump. I have the following setup on my machine:

1 18gb 15krpm U320 SCSI drive
1 120gb 7200rpm IDE drive with 8mb buffer

I only use about half of the 18gb drive for program files, windows, and software installations. The rest I fill up with Photoshop scratch disk when I am working on large files. My other drive only contains backup data, my PSD artwork, my website back, mp3s, and DIVX movies. I then backup all these about every three months onto DVDs. This way I have fastest possible access speed for my software, and I never worry about loosing data.

For security reasons keep all your security information on your second harddrive and it becomes incredibly more diffecult to steal remotely. When your software drive becomes infected with trojans, spyware, viruses, corrupted files, incomplete installs, windows problems, and so forth merely format the drive and reinstall your software. Then you will have a cleaner fresher start without loosing\recovering your vital data.
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Exoudeous · Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2003 9:23 pm

Thanks Cheney, youve been really helpfull. ill get the dvd+RW when I have the money too, and Ill upgrade, the ram as I progress to bigger work. Im still trying to get better at photoshop, and without a wacom, Its hard to make anything insanly big or detailed.

And I will section off my hard drive. but I dont know how Razz

. Is there any sites that give a step by step process of doing it?

Thanks once again
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bearsclover · member Member # Joined: 03 May 2002 Posts: 274

Partitioning in XP is very easy. Hmmm...It should be easy to find a link showing you how to do it, but trust me, if I (a Mac girl) can do it, it's a piece of cake! Wink

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Exoudeous · Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2003 3:13 pm

Well I just orderd my comp. It has the same specs as above, but I upgraded it to 1.5 GB SDRAM. and I got a new veiwsonic 19.

I have some left over money now, So now I finally can get a wacom Very Happy

I just need to figure out how to partition my drives now, and ill be set

Thanks for all you help people, I can wait to start posting my work once I get my stuff set up.
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cheney · Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2003 3:50 pm

Awesome, I hope you truely enjoy it.
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