[spooge demon]

A new PC is coming tomorrow for spooge. I thought briefly about building my own, but it has to work tomorrow, not Tuesday, so the extra money is a little bit of insurance.

I have been painting on a Mac since 94 (Photoshop for windows did not exist then). I use a PC for everything else so I have a passing familiarity with it.

There have been threads floating with "post your desktop!" themes, and my question is to all those who use windows (I hope there are a few around). What are some good strategies for using this machine? How have people set theirs up for getting things done, and having things stay organized, easy to access, easy to restore after OS reinstall, etc.

Specifically, my machine will have a SCSI primary raid 0 that will house the OS and working files. I plan on having two other drives of 200 GB each for backup/archive. This sound OK?

I have had my 1st PC for 5 years now, and had to reinstall the OS every year or so. In between, it is far more stable than my mac, even with OS X. BUT, having to reinstall all apps is medieval in the extreme, so I was wondering if there was any way around this. Apps on 2nd drive and backup registry?

Any ideas would be great!

[see]

i use MAC for school only and i have to agree. They suck somtimes

Well im quite happy with my PC at home although i don't have any special hardware in use.
I save my stuff on CD RW's or burn it on DVD
I would say a second hdd would be great for storing your files ! And 200 GB is abolutely crazy but you will fill it soon i guess.

An extern or a removeable HDD is cool to be safe against viruses.
For sure you can backup your registry and apps but i guess you have to install them evrytime you reinstall your OS

By the way choose Windows 2000 Prof , it works great and doesn't use that much of RAM as Windows XP.
My system works fine for more than 1 year without reinstall the OS. Keep an eye on the order of driver you have to install. Start with the motherboard, and at the end graficcard.
Use an Antivirprog.

�hhmm ... im i wrong please feel free to correct

So may it's my turn now to ask you something ?

[B0b]

i agree with the Win 2K for workstation - there are those who say that they prefer XP..

i use a RAID 0 (no redundancy - its a numbers game if ur HDD's bite the dust) for my Workstation and back up using a DVD+R (each disk allows 4.7Gb of data to b backed up in just under 15mins) and as the largest work i do comes in @ just over a gig at a time its a cheap option for me)

as for restoring a m8 of mine is an admin for a large company near here and they use Norton Ghost for installing their OS's again if they go tits up (i just spend a couple of hours installing it all again which is once in a blue moon - the reason i re-installed my 2k after a year and 1/2 was because i upgraded to RAID ) (u can also use ghost to back up

another good app is Ad aware << lots of nasty websites out there which install spy-ware - i run this every now and then to kill anything thats been installed in the registry etc without my permission

if your going to have a couple of 200Gb HDD for backup i'd have a removeable drive bay and put them both in removeable caddies - then u could have a seperate back-up on each (remember not to keep them in the same building as ur computer - oh and they won't b hot swappable so remember to power down ur PC each time u put 1 in and out)

don't install lots of 'crap' utiilities, its not as easy as going in2 ur extensions folder and chucking them out if they're shite..

i have a seperate partition for my OS (7.9Gb), my Work (9.9Gb), my apps (11.9Gb), my Web Dev (3.9Gb), completed movies (for film edited stuff) (9.9Gb), Raw Film Footage (for DV camera footage = huge files @ 3Mb/s) (99.9Gb), my normal CD writing partion - for useful utilities, stuff i collect along the way (1.9Gb), and my PS Scratch (6.7Gb)

[Yuri]

If you want browsers that can block pop-up windows intelligently, there's Mozilla but it doesn't work for certain sites, unfortunately so the next one would be Opera. IE is not bad but it can be a nasty thing at times like refusal to work properly.

Ad-blocking software has its' advantages and disadvantages. Advantages: works very well in blocking pop-ups, many are usually not resource-consuming. Dis-advantages: can cause major problems with your anti-virus software, I also personally had Adaware mess up my newly formatted system so badly I'd to reinstall my entire system.

And actually, what software you install on your operating system determines how well your o/s works. Some softwares like Win 2k better while others will kill ur pc if they don't get onto Win XP.

http://www.blackviper.com/
This guy's site tells you what to disable and what to enable, to get optimum settings. ^___^
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I am asexual. Neither male nor female.

[Gort]

Yes Bob - the easiest way to restore a system is to make an "image" of your setup. Installing it is a one time deal and painless. I would certanly go that route. Create an image of your machine with all the software installed (and preferences), etc and then store it as an image. Imaging a machine was common practice when I worked for Bellsouth, so when I got a new box I only had to install the image (and we did use Norton's Ghost for the task).

As for XP vs Win2K:
XP Pro is a bit more heavy on system resources, but you can actually tool it back; the default settings can, when coupled with lots of open sessions, create what appear to be frame dropping. I've turned all of the visual uber cool stuff, like fading menus, drop shadows on windows, transparencies, completely off, and that seemed to have eliminated the problem (it's a simple laptop - 1 ghz machine). WinXP Pro is by far more a lot user friendly when communicating to cameras, printers, scanners, network configs, etc. Overall it's the most stable thing, along with Win2K, out of Redmond these days.

My primary production box is Win2K, and I love it too. What can I say? It's robust and stable as all get out. It's not as fancy as XP but just as functional. By default it's ready to go upon installation, although you can tweak it as well for performance.

I believe that most of the software - that you would use, Spooge - is completely compatible with either OS.

I know I missed something...might come around later
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- Tom Carter

"You can't stop the waves but you can learn to surf" - Jack Kornfield

[Yuri]

If I am not wrong, Win XP Pro is much more stable than Win XP Home. Win XP Home is not so good at managing memory and it can screw up some of your software.

And yes, the visual settings are a real hog and be careful about right-clicking on a file or folder. M$ has confirmed that doing so, can raise your cpu usage to 100% o_O;;

To disable visual settings, right-click on the desktop, choose Properties. And then choose the tab "Appearance" and choose "effects". Then uncheck every single thing in there.

Finally, in case things are going cranky on your pc, do this: go to Control panel, choose Administrative Tools and then choose Computer Management. You can then access the Event Viewers from there. The Event Viewers will show most of the error messages that occured on your pc. Especially the System Event Viewer which is quite important.
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I am asexual. Neither male nor female.

[cheney]

I have things set up in a bizarre way. First of all I don't like explorer.exe (the default shell for the Windows GUI), so I use Geoshell for my desktop environment. I also have a dual monitor setup, because my vid card supports dual monitors up to high resolutions.

The benefits to a dual monitor setup is better accuracy in Photoshop on large images. You stretch Photoshop to occupy both monitors simultaniously. Then on one monitor you have the currect project open zoomed out so that it fits on screen. You can look to this image window for composition, overall lighting, and color tones. Then on the other monitor you can open that same project into a new window. In Photoshop 7 from the main menu choose Window -> Documents -> New Window. In this one you can zoom all the way into 100% for accuracy, detailing, and specific lighting for object shading and bump texturing. The new window feature works very well because changes to one window will be instantly reflected into the other window upon completed rendering of the filter or tool.

I see there is a mention of versions of WinXP. For me the Pro version of XP is much better. All versions of WinXP can determine differences of physical (SMP) and logical (SMT) processors, but only WinXP Pro will use more than 1 physical processor. So, any sort SMP (Simultaneous Multiprocessing) system needs atleast the Pro version of WinXP. Windows 2000 cannot determine a difference between physical and logical processors. So, if you attempt to run dual processors with hyperthreading enabled Windows 2000 willl see 4 processors rather than 2 and due to licensing will require atleast the Server version.
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[makototaramoto]

a good free adware removel is here http://www.lavasoftusa.com/software/adaware/ but it cam mess up any programs such as kazaa which i heard doesnt run with adware taken out like the program does....also when you have time research into buildin a comp i am building one this summer it hasnt been a big part of life for the moment till its doen of course Part list w/links and info i just need to update price i think its $900 and something very cheap for a good comp and im adding a dvd writer and another 80 gigs down the road as well as adding more ram....

Mercer
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mercer

[dr . bang]

I dont know why you even need SCSI drives, its much more expensive, loud and complex. With the current IDE harddrive today, they can be almost as fast as SCSI drives with so much more advantage.

I'm using my WindowsXP Pro for almost two years now and i have never have to reinstall it once. And i can't seem to recall when was the last time an error message popping up my screen. Best of all, my photoshop NEVER crashes.

"What are some good strategies for using this machine? "
Dont download junks spyware on your computer. I take care of it like your mom take care of her kitchen. It makes your life so much easier once you have a good understanding of it. I guess with a man like you, that should be a piece of cake.

"How have people set theirs up for getting things done, and having things stay organized"

Easy, keep every thing you work in a organized folder system. Put your work in "work" folder, your porn in "Visual Basic 5.0" folder. Btw, check out Loki's harddrive organization technique on his homepage too. I did the same way as him and it really does help.

"easy to restore after OS reinstall, etc. "
WindowsXP have the ability to RESTORE your computer to whenever time in the past you want to restore it to. And once you do that, all the system will go back in time and be just like they were. But you have to set a Restore Point for the time period before you can retore into it.

This is great because you don't have to reinstall windows, it just takes you back to the good old day.


Do i get a kiss from u for this post ? ^_______^
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[Citizen Cow]

Youll get a kiss from me for the helluvit.

[Tomasis]

tell me about your computer specifications

I dont know if SCSI is worth the price but I think that four IDE with raid 0+1 would be better option

I could set up WD Raptor 36gb at raid0 and 4x WD 120gb 8mbcache with raid0+1 as backup and extra storage for more unnecessary files

I could buy DVD-R writer to save finished works or something

the good memory and motherboard are very important.. a bad memory can make the computer to crash ..

XP or W2K.. it doesnt matter.. it doesnt make any difference when you're using a new computer

good luck

edit

I agree with other here that norton ghost is very good app but I use it very rarely .. because I format my c: only due to hardwares changes
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out

[cheney]

[dr . bang]

OH PLEASE DONT HAVE TO YELL AT ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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[Lunatique]

JV16 Power Tools-- For cleaning your registry and fixing mistakes.

Diskeeper-- Keeps your harddrives in tip-top shape.

Norton Antivirus-- Very fast at catching viruses.

Norton Ghost-- For restoring your operating system with all the installed software intact.

Ad Aware-- no more spyware.

Popup Stopper-- quite handy. Advertisers are ruthless these days.

Advanced Disk Catalogue-- Keeps your burned CD ROMs organized.

And of course, keep a seperate harddrive just for your scratch disk. I'm too cheap for that, so I just set mine on another harddrive that's got space on it. . ..

[Novacaptain]

http://www.guerillapixel.com/pages/digital_ill_main.htm
for all it's worth, i think loki seems to have a firm grasp on this.
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It's nice to be important, but more important to be nice - Scooter

[B0b]

RAID 0 IDE = 60-80Mb/s

RAID 0 SCSI = 100-140Mb/s

[Ragnarok]

Before I got XP Pro I used DriveImage to restore my computer whenever it crashed or needed a clean up. Now I don't know if it's as good as Norton Ghost, but it was pretty good when I used it...
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"Ever forward, my darling wind." -Master Yuppa
Seigetsu

[spooge demon]

Thanks folks, all really good info. Tomasis, the sys is a dual xeon, 4gb ram and 4 scsi raid-able drives. WinXP. Yes it was expensive, and I paid 140 bucks for it to be here Monday morning and it is still lost at sea. Must have gone around the horn.

Norton Ghost sounds like a winner, once I get everything correct.

Cheney, I kinda like Geoshell, thanks

So here are the drives
4x 36 GB scsi drives
2x200 GB ide drives

As I understand it, I will RAID 0 the 4x36GB drives for one logical disk of (um 4x36�) 144 GB. I will then make a 10 GB partition for OS/apps, 10 GB empty for scratch, and the rest for data files. Since losing a days work would cause me to jump off a bridge (or rather be thrown off by a client) I think I will use retrospect for daily backups of the working file partition to one of the 200 GB IDEs.

This second 200 GB will have daily backup and archive of all files I own. This will be duplicated in a third 200 GB drive. There is too much data and the disks are too small, and cataloging and retrieval are a major pain to use DVDs. Magnetic drives are cheap fast, always online. I will, as a final precaution, make a DVD set and send it to my Dad.

Yes See, ask away.

mm cows making me hot

[B0b]

your gonna need more than 10Gb for XP sys + apps imho spooge

make 3x 10Gb partitions 1 for XP, 1 for ur apps and 1 for scratch

they Seagate or Maxtor SCSI ?

[lalPOOO]

B0b, my knowldge doesn't compare to yours really, but I don't think he'll need more then 10 gig for apps. It may come close, but I don't know why he'd need a lot more then 10 gigs, just for apps. Xp is about 1.1gigs. I'm not a good example, but I have photoshop, maya PLE, and a bunch of other apps in my program files, and its only 2.7 gigs. Sure, I'm probably not as serious about high end apps, but my situation can at least be used as some sort of example. So, as I said before, I doubt he'll need more then 10 gigs.

[Lunatique]

Believe me, if you use a host of 2D and 3D apps--and install just one data intensive game like UT2003(I dunno if Spooge is a gamer--I don't think he's ever mentioned it), you'd hit 10 gigs quick. In fact, I'm regretting using a 13 gig partition for my OS and apps. I should've used more.

Good call on your backup scheme Spooge. I went the other way of using CD ROMS, and OMIGOD I have a huge 200 CD folder filled up now after about 1 1/2 years. I keep thinking I'll hold off on getting big-ass harddrives for backup/data until my short film generates more data that justifies it. But now the thought of rebuilding my storage archive with CD ROMS.... I don't even want to think about it.

BTW, how permanent and reliable are tape drives?

[B0b]

well - tape drive = magnetic = only as good as the drive thats using it = keep the heads clean and shouldn't have any trouble = also keep away from strong magnetic source (ie don't leave it on top of ur wacom tablet )

there are some excellent drives out there that can do 40Gb of compressed data - but your prolly looking more towards 32/5 ish

i'm not saying he will need more than 10 - like i said 10 for xp - 10 for apps - and 10 for scratch

with 4 Gb RAM he'll need to match the RAM for Pagefile without receiving a penalty from Windows to b safe i'd set the Pagefile @ 6Gb min/6Gb max leaving 3Gb ish left for XP.. that doesn't leave alot for apps does it?? hmm

[Torstein Nordstrand]

Lots of good advice here, be sure to drop in when Xp starts hassling you - it's very tweakable if you know just how!

Just like to add that IMO the best way of setting up a PC to last "forever" is simply by not installing all kinds of junk software/hardware on it. I have two machines - one (old) for surfing, mail, games and a host of fancy schmancy applications - for all the practical daily uses. The other machine (new/fast) basically only has XP, Photoshop, Painter, work files, and graphic resources, and that's about it.

This way you'll also have a backup PC if the hardware fails one day.

Remember that every extra device installed on your PC will be hogging resources and potentially cause conflicts down the line. Keep it simple. I too only backup to another drive - on the other PC. This also makes it safer in case of a virus attack /meltdown.

My monitor, a Sony G520, has two inputs so it is plugged straight into both PCs at once. I flip from one machine to the other with a switch on the front of the screen.

So if you have a spare pc (or even a mac!), this might be a useful alternative for you.

Have fun!
PS: I envy you your hardware to no end
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[spooge demon]

It is here and it is huge. But not very heavy. Hows that for pointless information?

It is SO nice. I am kicking myself for not doing this a lot sooner. Test file, layered 4k image with 15 layers~120 mb. TO open, mac- 12 seconds PC 2.5. That's hardly a fair fight, and you could pay apple equally serious bucks to get your scsi raid. But everything else is that much faster. I have always thought benckmarks are WORTHLESS. What gets you in the end is how responsive the system is to every little task you give it. You might do 10 thousand in a days work. Fractional seconds add up. The mac, even the dual ghz, always seemed slow, less responsive than my old 400mhz dell running NT.

The video card is very fast, esp turning layers on and off in big files, which I do a lot.


Since I cannot stripe the drive containing the system, one of the 4x36 GB remains as the drive for system/apps. I don't understand the point of keeping apps on a second drive/partition. The exposure is the same, and having all on one drive makes it easier to use ghost for an image. Since it does not change daily, this should be ideal for system/apps.

Lunatique, oh man, why even think of tape? Just use a big HD and reset the backup evey 6 months. I had an exabyte drive back in the time of fairies. I eventually shot it through the eyes in frustration. Expensive, slow, unreliable, obsolete.

If anyone is bored, would a normal full size pickup be able to carry 200 GB of floppys?

Couple of things are buggin me, though. In mac land the key that does what the Ctrl key does is next to the space bar, and you used your thumb. The control key seems way out there and makes me stretch. Take some getting used to. The other is the dual monitor setup. I will have to switch so my main monitor is on the left, no way around it. The way the palettes and program wells work seem to be designed that way, if this was thoght about at all.

The machine has 4GB memory, but the systems reports 3.37GB. And photoshop tells me available RAM is 1777MB. I set my VM to 4GB on the system partition and 4GB on dedicated scratch volume on the RAID. maybe get rid of the paging file on the system disk? But what is up with missing memory? The devices are recognized, just not the amount.

Bob, drives are Fujitsu

Torstein, I used to switch my mac and PC with the inputs on one monitor. No More!

[:::nVIDIA:::]

Hey Craigy,

From the spec that's one helluva machine you got there. 4 GB's of memory?...and 4 HD's?.....AND dual Xeons??!! Well, you got some nerve..Actually have you thought of the new hyper thread processor that mimics dual proc's?..it's too late now...but I've considered it. Well, now you've inspired me to get a dual Xeons too.

I've always had PC's as I would always crash Mac's at Rhythm and Hues..and alot of 3d I wanted to get didn't run on Mac's. Anyway, did you read the spec on G5?....that's one hot machine....

Welp, it sounds like you got the PC setup fine..you may have to reboot once a day...and DEFRAG every week. Another thing, you may want to get an external HD just in case to back up your stuffs....maybe two. It would pain in the butt if your PC just stop working.

What kind of video card did you get?...

Ed--
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[jr]

[PhatTexta]

One thing i find anoying with macs is the way u can control easily minimizing and maximizing to full screen, its freckin anoying all the shortcuts n stuff with apple aswell

if ur playing money pc's u get more for ur moneys worth..

hey spoogy check ur pm

[Pat]

I hear you with the ctrl key placement making shortcuts annoying. It's a minor nit-pick for sure, but with the Command key located next to the spacebar it's so much easier to one-hand all the common functions. Command S, Command X, Command V are all thumb and index finger. CTRL S,X, and V are all pinkie and index finger, which is far more cumbersome. Command W for closing the active window is easy as well on a Mac, but on the PC it's alt F4. A simple cut, paste, save and shut the window is a chaotic symphony of hand movement. Additionally, I literally had to rip the Windows start button off my keyboard because it resided between the ctrl and alt buttons. Pushing that accidently would yank you out of Photoshop and open the Start menu. Talk about your "fractional seconds" adding up. :/

I guess the point is, no matter how fast your computer is, it's the user who's the slowest link in the chain.

-Pat

[dr . bang]

[mOO]

Dont know if this helps but its about memory in windows..

http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/hwdev/platform/server/pae/paemem.mspx