[Steven Stahlberg]

A style experiment, using a toon shader to create outlines over my normal rendering. What do you think - could you watch a whole animation in this style?

[Golongria]

oh hell yes.

[grasshoppa]

deffinately could watch at least a trillogy of movies in this style.

[AliasMoze]

Steven,
I've been toying with the same thing. Personally, I like "toon shaded" stuff that looks like the 2D equivalent. 24 fps (on two's if the camera isn't moving), simple shadow or highlight.

BTW, is that a walking sentry gun? The girl looks awesome. So real.

[v1510nAry]

I could get used to it.

[BooMSticK]

looks real nice Steven! If Im not mistaken this is a redo of one of you 'older' renderings, right? How much is 3d in this image? All of it?
,boom

[silber]

as a single pic it looks really cool, would have taken it for a photoshop painted pic.
I would definitly like too see this style in motion.
The idea with the gun is great
Crit? Maybe it's only this particular render but me thinks that it contains too much middle grey tones and I don't really recognice what she has on her head; is this hair or a helmet ?
-Awesome work

[ August 22, 2002: Message edited by: silber ]

[skeletor]

nice,

did you make the toon shader from scratch
or did you modify existing one?

[ August 22, 2002: Message edited by: skeletor ]

[Steven Stahlberg]

Thanks! Yeah, that's a helmet, but not a very finished one I agree. All of it is 3d. For this one I used the freeware toonshader found at Highend3d.com in the Maya section, with the icon that looks like the Iron Giant, can't remember the name right now. Lately I've also been experimenting with Expressive Effect's toonshader. Yes it's a remake of one of my earliest images.

[jr]

steven this looks great, are you going to make something keep that helment on her head? or is it going to be like those baseball/construction helments that stay on the head without a strap.

oh btw, might i interest you in some poo?
www.eatpoo.com , join our secret forum!

[marc_taro]

Nice effect - works well - but to answer your main question - I don't think it's quite there for use in an extended peice. It's my feeling it would need to be more graphic to carry off a full length animation. Right now it's in a half rendered/half tooned space that is sort of neither film nor animation - I'd try for sharper defined shadow and highlight tones over the bleneded midtones. Just my 2 cents.

marctaro

[skeletor]

I agree with marc. It could be more graphic.

I thought that the shader you are using should produce more 2D feel... well, never used it, can't be sure.

[Lunatique]

So THAT'S what you've been up to! Very nice.

I think the look is wonderful. Not the typical cell-shaded stuff we see too much of.

Is it possible to do the same rendering style without the black lines?

Dude, you need to write me back. We have things to discuss still. In fact, email me your phone number(work or home) and I'll call you(tell me the best time to call). I've got some plans to run by you.

[ August 22, 2002: Message edited by: Lunatique ]

[Axl]

I'll be honest and say that as a single image I really like the outlined look but as an animation I'm not too sure about the outlined effect on some of the smaller details. It may possibly make it look cluttered and hard to make out certain areas.

P.S I see that your phone girl image has been used in an advert on cgchannel.com

[Rage_For_Me]

I really hope that this doesn’t make me sound stupid, but can someone tell me what a 'toon shader' is? And where I might get one.

Thanks,

Michael

[Icannon]

just awesome, stahlberg.

[Steven Stahlberg]

Thanks guys!
jr - I guess I'll add a strap, but I didn't want to obstruct her face...

marc_taro and skeletor - I'm leaning towards thinking you're right. But I don't want sharply defined shading, I want shading that ramps smoothly from dark to light (when it's supposed to). I'm so tired of the sharp shading, both in 2d, and in 3d emulating 2d.

Lunatique - without the black lines this is simply a normal render, except the ambient was turned up more.
btw sent you an email just now.

Axl - yes that's a concern I have too. Gotta simplify more. (About the phone girl, they have my permission thanks for mentioning it)

Rage_For_Me - a 'toon shader' makes your 3d renderings look more like cartoons, with outlines and flat colors. In my case I only used the outlines, composed with 'multiply' over the original normal rendering.

[aColdOldKodiak]

I agree that details might get cluttered, but even if you didn't pull it off I'd still watch an animation in this style.

[Malachi Maloney]

Nicely done Steven.
I would love to see an entire animated movie in this style.
Even if I had to settle for a sort.

Take it easy,
Malachi

[egerie]

I'm suprised no one mentionned Megalex or Technoperes so far.. It's a mix of 3d and painter French harcover comic.

Steven Stahlberg : I'd *love* to see something animated like this knowing how good your models are.. Heck, why not a 28 episodes tv serie ??! *greed n glee*

Here are a few examples of what I was mentionning :

[Malachi Maloney]

egerie~ That's some sweet stuff. Do you know of a good place on the net where I can see more?

~M~

[lalPOOO]

I think it'd be different, which would be cool. I mean, people have watched weirder stuff.(waking life, anime, beastiality)

Dunno if it matters but I'd watch somthing done in that kind of style.

[The Magic Pen]

Malachi unfortuantly that is one of those things were the cover is great and the rest of the book is OK... you can see more at www.humanoids-publishing.com I highly recommend MetaBarons for anyone who likes comic art , best of the best french style art by Juan Gimenez

Steven you are the masta 3D artist you can do no wrong...nuff said

[plastikman]

lol i bet shes happy her gun grew legs cuz thats one hell of a load she doesnt have to carry :P hahah i love it!

[Steven Stahlberg]

Excellent feedback I'll definitely take another look at Gil Elvgren and thanks for showing me those Technoperes and Megalex covers, just what I'm trying for except all in 3d so it can animate!

[Novacaptain]

wow, that's nice. I'd really love to see that animated...how about a little teaser walk-cycle for us hm?

Shows like futurama use an extensive amount of 3d -> 2d to make things rotate without problems - especially mechanical objects.

[Gil Agud�n]

Wow, that's great Steven, I love your models and you are achieving some impressive results with this toon render, show us more please! Is the background a texture or is it generated by the render?

It seems that John Byrne is also testing techniques with 3d toon renderings for his comic books, you can see some samples in the following urls:
http://www.stratacafe.com/image.asp?imageID=1202 http://www.stratacafe.com/image.asp?imageID=4074 http://www.stratacafe.com/image.asp?imageID=1539 http://www.stratacafe.com/image.asp?imageID=5128

And here is an interesting interview with Fred Beltran the artist of Megalex: http://www.comicon.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=12&t=000220

And here a little tutorial of how Beltran works (but it is in french): http://marquebd.free.fr/images/image3D.html

Novacaptain, do you know which is the toon render they are using in Futurama?

[ August 25, 2002: Message edited by: Gil Agud�n ]

[Novacaptain]

I�m not sure, it might be Animo...or some software they developed themselves. Disney creates a lot of their own software, wouldn�t be surprised if fox did too.