[Lorentz]

I can see I'm not going to change any opinions and I really didn't expect to so after this post I'm just going to let this topic die.

FatPenguin-"Nobody has a right to be proud of being born in a certain country. Just live where you want to live and leave it at that."
Why doesn't some one have the right to be proud of were they live? Thats simply your opinion and with out any facts to back it up its as valid as mine.

"They don't go out and buy handguns because they like killing things."
You can't be serious Americans don't go and buy guns just to kill things thats just idiotic. If its true back it up with facts ok.

"His failure to sign the Kyoto accord was inexcusable, "

Global warming is a farce the top climatoligist in the world all agree that its untrue. The top climatoligist at MIT (Massechusettes institute of technology, the top school in the nation and the world) along with several hundred other climatoligist from around the world signed a document several years ago stating that there is no evidince for global warming.

Jock-"Your counrty is the spirtitual homeland of everything crass, classless, uncultured and base in the modern world, and if you don't get us all blown up in the meantime history will remember you as such."
Give some specifics of why we are morally corrupt. I have friend who lived in glaslow scotland for 3 years another living lisbon portugal, another who studied abroad in italy, switzerland, germany, UK, spain, and france. All of them said they couldn't believe the pervasive sexual immorallity they found while over there, I'm speaking of the prevalence of pornography. (not necessarily in all of those countries). Second name one time America dragged the world into war? Can't can you?

"To be fair though, if it wasn't for the Americans I'd probably be speaking German
Note: ***SARCASM*** "
Next you're going to rag on America for being to isolationist. A lot of American's lost their lives saving what seems to be an ungrateful europe next time someone goes nuts in europe you all can save your own asses, fucking bastard. (I wasn't even going to bring this up but the disrespect shown for the people who lost their lives is unexcusable). Sorry if that sounds harsh but I have relatives who died in europe. P.S. Jock scotland is a 3rd world country.

[Akolyte]

You're all fucking morons! hooray! Without America, none of you would be alive! and without Al Gore, we would not have the Internet!

[Dthind]

I have no idea where to start;

The American people are as a lot good people, AND I WOULD say this about probably every country on then planet. The people are good, what (or who) represents them tends not to be such the role model.

The problem is people in charge (for what ever 'In Charge' actually means) tend to skew the rest of the world as to the people.

George W (aka junior) is not a great example of the American people.

Our election process, while needing some upgrades, is still a good system. The problem comes when two candidates are equally unappealing. The most recent election was a case in fact that the people of America were ambivelent towards both candidates. This being as evident by a 50/50 popular vote for each of them.

I will trade a week in boring southern california for a week in Dublin, Berlin, Helsinki, or where-ever just to learn. But that too is not enough to make a difference.

Sooner or later we (as a planet) need to pull all of our heads out of are asses and move past the petty bullshit. Get over the ego, the bigger gun principle or whatever keeps the BS alive.

Global warming is a reality, but that reality is variable to who you ask. But there are various individuals and institutions that tend to manipulate this information for personal and corporate gain. The true test will be how the planet responds to what we (Humans) have done to it, this will manifest itself within a few decades at most.

For all the damage that global warming has caused, whether it is by Mexico, the US, India, China or anyone else, NOW WHAT do we do.

In Closing,

We all know the problem, and we ALL talk about it, but WHAT is the Solution.

If any of you Europeans that are blasting the US are EVER in the US, you can stay with me (for a few days) to gain whatever perspective you need. This has to stop somewhere, and we ALL need to do something on an individual level to help.

Sorry, Rant Over.....

Thanks...
gracias
merci
danke

and so on...

[Jezebel]

[sarcasm]

Jock -

I have to commend you. You have obviously spent a lot of time traveling through the United States meeting every single American that has lived throughout your lifetime. This couldn't have been easy. It is a truly amazing accomplishment. It's especially astounding that you understand us all SO well that you can say we all think and act the exact same way! Wow! I'm impressed!

I can partially understand the difficulty behind your great journey because I visited Scotland once. I now know it's true that everyone there wears kilts! EVERYONE!

Oh wait... what am I saying? I'm American, so that means I'm a brainwashed moron. Silly me!

We have people like you around here. They are called Klansmen. They like to parade around and bash entire cultures based on stereotypes as well. Ever heard of them?



[/sarcasm]

[ June 13, 2001: Message edited by: Jezebel ]

[FatPenguin]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Lorentz:
FatPenguin-"Nobody has a right to be proud of being born in a certain country. Just live where you want to live and leave it at that."
Why doesn't some one have the right to be proud of were they live? Thats simply your opinion and with out any facts to back it up its as valid as mine.

---

Let me just explain what i meant by that. I believe you should only take pride in things which you accomplish yourself. To be proud because you happen to live in the same country as various other people who happened to do things of great signifigance is silly.

I have heard people more or less imply that they are better than someone else because they, through no choice of their own, came to live in a country that is capable of destroying half the world, or is leading country in terms of... whatever. Unless you personally were responsible for bringing the country to that level, you are just taking pride in other people's accomplishments. So if you are not Fidel Castro, what right or reason do you have for being patriotic?

America is the perfect expample of ridiculous patriotism. Seriously, what is the point in all the flag waving and anthem singing? People there like in no other nation take personal offence when a remark is made about their country. They are lead to believe, and encouraged to recite that they live in 'the greatest country in the world' which is in itself somewhat racist.

If there are any proud americans out there, i really would be interested to know:

what the hell is the point?

[Lorentz]

First American isn't a race its a culture, there are only 3 recognized races black, white, and asian, sorry I forget the scientific terms. Second just because I'm proud of the country I live in doesn't mean I think im better than other individuals I'm not remember we are all created equal. Sorry if you took what I said to mean I think I'm better than others thats not what I meant, I was simply expressing my opinion of my country.

[starfish]

=D

*hands Jock McxSporran some yummy greek salad*

what's really scary is that he seems
to totally lack any 'doing good' ability.
seems he's trying to do a remix of his dad's
stunt by finding every way he can to
make up enemies so he can get credit for
'saving the world' =)
but it won't be too hard for him since he
got the spooks constructing 'conflicts'
for him over the world.
and hey, wars sell weapons =D

[ June 13, 2001: Message edited by: starfish ]

[Lorentz]

Jock- Our ridiculouse gun culture, 33% of Autrailians and over 25% of citizens in Great Britian were the victims of violent crime last year (rape, murder, violent assault) in the US the number was less than 10% yet the US has a high per capita gun desity than both the UK and Aus, and both of those countries have extreemely represive gun control laws. By the way Switzerland who's gun density per capita far exceeds even the US had the lowest percentage of violent crime of any developed nation. Yeah our gun culture is ridiculous.

[Kjetil Nystuen]

Yes Lorentz, your gun culture IS ridiculous. The right to have a gun = more shooting. It is as simple as 2+2. And I'd like to see where you got those numbers from. Probably from hardcore conservative organisation in the US which never has been in any other country.

[Lorentz]

Every country puts out thoses statistics its just a simple fact i've read it in consevative and liberal publications, give me a bit and ill find them for you.

[Jock McxSporran]

lol

1) I'm not going to feel "grateful" to you for something that someone else did decades before I was born in another country. YOU didn't fight and die in the war, nobody you know or have known fought and died in the war, and most of the people who did fight and die in the war would have been dead by now anyway.

I'm not being disrespectful to anyone, I have a great interest and admiration for what that generation did, but that doesn't mean for I second that I should feel gratitude to a whole nation just by association.

Besides which the Russians lost more people during the war than all the other allies combined, so if I'm going to express grattitude to anyone I'm affraid I'll be turning east and shouting "величайшая благодарность" before I thank you lot.

2) I have lots of American friends, and they agree with me for the most part. Generalisations are rarely kind to anyone, but in my experience there are two kinds of American. Those who are ashamed to be American, and those who are proud of it. The one's who are ashamed of it tend to be thoughtfull, intelligent and gracious. The one's who are proud of it tend to be arrogant, loud and stupid. This isn't only true of Americans. All nations have their moronic "patriots", it's just that in America they are in the majority, rather than a minority. I find patriotism just as ridiculous coming from a Scot as I do from a Yank, the difference is that most Jocks don't bite so easily. Which brings me to...

3) You are perfectly welcome to take the piss out Scotland, I do it all the time. I don't owe Scotland any loyalty, because the fact that I was born here is nothing more than fluke. I only enjoy Yank-baiting because it seems hardly any of you can stand critisism of your country, and you have proved that point admirably and given me enormous amusement into the bargain.

I just hate seeing people taking personal credit for stuff which has fuck-all to do with their own acheivements.

I'm quite certain there are lot's of Americans who have read my bile and recognised it for what it is, and laughed their asses off (maybe even *whisper it* recognised IRONY ), but if anyone has taken offence at it then good, I'm glad I've offended you. I'm glad I'm offended you because simply by being offended you have proved the point I was making.

[Twice]

hehe..... this turned into a large discussion!

gLitterbug: Yes, German and Norwegisn is pretty similar. I had to learn German for four years during school.

schabe: You are right! "Har de" is equal to "haben sie". What is f****-up about the norwegian school system is that when we learn German, we focus on grammar. I would bet my car on that we would communicate better if we used more time on speaking the language! I got the impression during my last visit to germany, that the German people didn't care to much if I spoke uncorrectly grammar.

Dthind: I think you are wrong. (didn't think I would say this to a US citizen). One of the roles as a President is the Lawmaker, but the Senate decides if it is going to be or not! Anyway...... I might be wrong!

edible snowman: Yes, I agree. they suck. I think it is a bit odd that for beeing the president there is a need of huge amounts of money! cutting research in alternative fuel is a good thing for the american economic system, bacause of the great resources of oil you guys have! When you say digging up alaska, I think you are wrong! That might be the most environmental friendly oil area in the world. Building a platform on top of the ice is a great idea. with the new thecnology we have, there is possible to drill for oil in a radius of 7 miles from where actual drilling happens.(that was a lousy explenation!) Anyway, I think it is great. And just for the record: A school in Norway has invented a way to make cars move using hydrogen gas.

Totally: Hehe....maybe you should run for Precidency?!. hehe! Let us sijun guys handel your campaign!

Kjetil Nystuen: I find him very slick. Don't like him! Anyway. There seem to be differnt points of view on the moral of Mr. Bush.
My aunt lives in Boston, and she thinks Bush is dangerous! Eeasy said.

MrPumpernickel: fint du forstod det. Anyway. the compotition to my knowledge was because Florida has more of those guys that again vote for the president. Anyway, I don't know to much about this, so I just shutt up!

gLitterbug: Ich bin Auslander und sprechen nicht gut Deutsch. Ich finde Bush eine tickende Bombe.

Kjetil Nystuen: that missile defence system is worring me to. I saw at the news the other day, when our prime minister had just met mister Bush. Stoltenberg seemed very convinced that this was a good idea. Anyway, they are loosing votes, an I think that is great. A missile defenc system will be very risking in my opinion.

social drone: mmmm..... I wouldnt call Bush a Drunkard, when he has been sober for many years. And when it comes to his granpa supporting Hitler, that is not realy relevant. Anyway, many good points!

starfish: I watched 60 minutts the other day. There was something there about creating a oil field in alaska. I more or less agree. This would be some of the most environmental friendly oil fields in the world. Of course, I don't think there should a probleme for the alsaka wilderness.

Ok.... i guess I have written enough now. Sorry guys for my crappy english. Just a final point of view on that everyone has a right to own a gun, is bullshit. i hate guns, and there should be a realy strict system on this.

anyway.......bye!

[starfish]

don't forget that we are all coming from the
same source. noone is better or worse than
the other =)
though it's easy to wonder why some people
don't react when things obviously are
endangering all of us. mostly it's because of
not being told about the problem. sometimes
it's because the problem seems too big to
grasp and therefore it's easy to believe that
'ohh dang, this is over my head, I will never
be able to change things'. and just ignore it.
the secret trick is not to ignore it.
instead, talk to other people about it and
you will find that there are others who feel
the same way you do.
just look at the happenings earlier this spring.
39 of the worlds largest pharmaceutical
companies sued the south african government
over the use of nonpatented drugs to treat
HIV infected humans in South Africa.
many people were outraged after finding out that
the pharmaceutical companies felt that money
meant more than other humans lives.
well, one thing led to another and thanks
to lots of people all over the world signing
up on msf's online petition, talking about
it in various media etc. on april 19 the
pharmaceutical companies withdrew their case =D
so, it's not hard to change things you feel
is not good. you just have to let other people
know about it and see if they feel the same =)
start today by saying hello to your neighbors,
if you usually don't do that. ;D

*hands out milk and cookies to all* =D

[ June 14, 2001: Message edited by: starfish ]

[ June 14, 2001: Message edited by: starfish ]

[ June 14, 2001: Message edited by: starfish ]

[ June 14, 2001: Message edited by: starfish ]

[starfish]

oops...forgot...
here's some great information. http://www.flrt.com/
check out 'The Paperless Office' =)

[Lapjos]

Doppelganger!!

[ June 16, 2001: Message edited by: Lapjos ]

[Lapjos]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Lapjos:
[QB][b]

gLitterbug: Yes, German and Norwegisn is pretty similar. I had to learn German for four years during school.

I got the impression during my last visit to germany, that the German people didn't care to much if I spoke uncorrectly grammar.

[QB]

---

Damn! I am trying to get a grip on Finnish, but to me it seems not that similar to German Anyway, you are right about Germans not caring about your grammar. How should they, if they themselves use the wrong grammar?
ATM there's a french exchange student in my class and well I never thought about it much, but the last days showed my German grammar sucks. I think your German grammar is better than mine!

farvel tai hyv�sti tai ciao tai cya tai tsch�ss tai tot siens tai adios tai adieu tai Quapla'! [4 the Trekkies *g*]

PS: French English sucks!! Didn't even recognize he's talking English! eg "about" he pronounced it "aboot" - they learn it that way from their teachers, don't know if that applies to whole France but at least it applies to the Normandy.....

[ June 16, 2001: Message edited by: Lapjos ]

[Twice]

Lapjos:
I doubt my grammar is better than yours. To be perfectly honestly, I hate the German language.(no offence). Finish is not similar to Norwegian or German at all. for one wierd reason it is most simmilar to Arabic. People from Zyria, and the lands in that area, understand what a finnish person says.

wierd!

[Lapjos]

quote:

---

Originally posted by andskj:
Lapjos:
I doubt my grammar is better than yours. To be perfectly honestly, I hate the German language.(no offence). Finish is not similar to Norwegian or German at all. for one wierd reason it is most simmilar to Arabic. People from Zyria, and the lands in that area, understand what a finnish person says.

wierd!

---

Yep, that's weird and interesting to know! and no offence taken at all, as long as we can communicate with each other and may it be with our hands and feets everything is fine!