[]Aratex[]

Hi.. I've been around the forum for a while, posted a bit of my beginning 3D work last fall as I was working on it and I've read a lot of posts around here since then. Anyway, I'm troubled now as I'm faced with the decision of what to do with my life. I grew up on computers, always learning and growing and learning more.. I know quite a lot about computers after constant exposure to them for 14 years. It's always seemed logical to me that I would do something with computers when I grew up, but as everyone now knows, that's a pretty broad idea these days..

As I stated before, last fall, I fell into the world of 3D art.. I'm not very good yet, and I know that, but I loved the few months I spent working long days on art projects.. I'm intrigued by the possibilities and I want to learn more.

I found what sounds like a good school for 3D animation, which is where the bulk of my interest is, and I've done quite a few 3D stills already that could be used for an application portfolio. However, my self-confidence has hit a wall. For almost 6 months, I was in a dry spot. No ideas, not even a hint of an idea. I've come to doubt if I should even continue to consider art anymore for a number of reasons.

1) It's not all that uncommon for me to have long periods where I lack creativity.

2) I've continued going over my old work and I simply don't feel that it's good enough anymore.

3) I'm even less talented with other forms of art than I am with 3D. In all I've read from 3D artists and even in the specs of the portfolio that I'm supposed to send in, it seems that 3D artists are often expected to be talented 2D artists as well as talented with sketching, etc. for working on concepts before anything is ever taken into 3D.


So this is my dilemma.. Should I try to follow my dream of being an artist? Is it possible that I could learn more at 3D animation school than how to use Max (or whatever they teach) efficiently? Is it possible for art school to make someone who isn't naturally talented into a good artist?

Any advice, etc. would be greatly appreciated.. and if anyone's interested/curious, I'd be happy to dig up some of my 3D work so that you could see what I've got to work with..

[dr . bang]

To be good at any form of art, you have to draw well. That's all you need to do, draw well

Do you mind if i know your age and see some of your work? I might answer more if i see them.

[]Aratex[]

Well, that's the problem. I don't draw well. I just don't. I try, I can envision these beautiful images in my head, but my hands simply refuse to make them the way I see them. That's part of what I'm asking, can someone be taught to draw?

In answer to your question, I'm 19 years old and currently going into my second year of "waste time while I figure out what I'm doing" college. :-)

I'll get my old work together at a decent resolution and post some links asap.

Edit: Images are now up on my crappy Freeservers site. (It's the only option I have at the moment.) Here come the links...
Wintery scene
Dinner for two
Great hall
The sword in the stone - Disney inspired, but never quite finished.. I have plans to finish it soon, though.

There.. That was what I had handy.. Finding more would be more work..

[ July 14, 2001: Message edited by: ]Aratex[ ]

[dr . bang]

quote:

---

Originally posted by ]Aratex[:
Well, that's the problem. I don't draw well. I just don't. I try, I can envision these beautiful images in my head, but my hands simply refuse to make them the way I see them. That's part of what I'm asking, can someone be taught to draw?

---

ANY body can be taught to draw, first you have to teach your self how to draw, once you're good, go to an art school to expand your skill even further.

After viewing some of your 3d images, i think you should stick on praticing drawing even more. Animation school requirement are VERY high, if you pratice hard drawing for 2-4 more years, i think they will accept your work at that time.

[kaylon]

just to make a comment here....

Some of the best 3D artists in the trade...can't draw to save there lives...They SUCK.!.

I have worked with some amazing 3D artist and animators..one of which was formaly with Lucas Arts...and he had trouble drawing a good looking Stick man, but he was one of the best dam modellers and animators I've worked with.

Also...famous artist from the past...some traditional painters could not Draw as such...but the could express feelings..and passion...and THATS what art..in any form is about..PASSION...not creativaty..or technical brilliance, but passion, feelings, emotions.

Keep at it..

Kay.

[]Aratex[]

dr. bang: I've no intention of going to a "normal" art school anyway, I just know I'm not that good.. The place I plan to go has a hard, focused 3D animation only program, and that's what I'm looking into. (Perhaps I didn't clearly state 3D animation before, or perhaps you were still emphasizing drawing as the end-all and be-all of artistic ability.) From then information I've seen and read, it doesn't seem like they expect me to have any 3D background at all when I apply.

kaylon: I thought that that might be a possibility.. Well, I hoped anyway. :-) I don't see why people always assume that drawing and 3D must go together even though they're so different. I can certainly see how, in some situations, being able to draw would be a plus, but I don't think it is absolutely necessary. I definitely agree with you that art is about passion far more than anything else.

Anyone else? Please? I need feedback, this is an important decision.

[ July 14, 2001: Message edited by: ]Aratex[ ]

[J Bradford]

Your art is good, VERY good. I strongly suggest that you do NOT give up. My recommendation would be to practice, and then practice some more. Draw every day whenever you have free time. You cannot become a good 3d artist over night, in a week, month, or a year. It takes a long time, it's a long learning process.

In art school you would gain a lot better drawing skills, with the classes you would take (Drawing, life drawing, 2d design, color theory - you probly already know this). That is the step I took, and Ive already finished my freshman year and I learned than I could ever imagine. Im majoring in 3d animation, and the department is great. You gain a lot of experience from your professors, on top of being surrounded by that type of enviroment all the time.

Drawing skills are a must, I don't care what people will tell you. Almost all 3d artist you see without using reference in 3d are amazing at drawing on paper, because that is where it started.

Some people will say art schools are a waiste of time, and learning 3d on your own is a good way. Well I agree with that in some aspect. If you really push yourself at an artschool, and use all the recources it offers, you come out with a lot more in 4 years.

[specialbrew]

'Should I try to follow my dream of being an artist?'

OK, for me that's your key question... if it is truly a dream, then if you don't pursue that you will always regret your choice. In a way, you will always feel compelled to return to this, because nothing else will do.

I've looked at the stuff you've posted and I sense a kind of impatience to just see an image of some kind, to get a picture finished. I'm no expert on 3D, but I don't get the impression you're pushing yourself at all on any of this work. I'm not sure being able to draw well is a prerequisite to do 'good' 3D, and to me you're using this as a mental brick wall to avoid really getting involved. You'll need to get past this.

Your pictures demonstrate you understand at least some fundementals of 3D, but what's really missing is effort. 3D is an incredibly time-consuming and often laborious excercise, but so far I don't see a willingness to commit to that in your images.

What you perceive as 'skill' is ultimately hard work, trial and error, research, learning and pushing the envelope of what you're capable of. You know the gap which exists between what you're doing and what is considered a professional standard - if you inwardly believe you can bridge this gap, then go for it and think of nothing else.

If you have doubt, then in all likelyhood you will not succeed - the world is just too competitive.

good luck

sb

[Quinnbeast]

Hmm, some interesting points being brought up here. It's kind of a tough question that you’re asking to be honest. Just for reference, I'm a 2nd year painting student at an art school in Scotland. I grew up the other way around; I was drawing on a regular basis from about the age of about 8, and was comfortable using a number of different materials by the time I hit Uni. On the other hand, I've only just started to learn about PC based graphics, I’m picking stuff up in my spare time...learning HTML and Photoshop etc.

One thing I've noticed, is that whether you work with a paint brush, a lump of clay, or a mouse pointer for 3d work, if you don’t have a good understand of form, perspective etc. then it doesn’t matter how good you are with a particular type of media. At the end of the day, that’s all software is – an alternative to using a paintbrush or a pencil. Relying on software alone won’t get you far.

Above all else, it's about thought processes and problem solving more than drawing skills or anything else. It's a common misconception that people just dream up some stunning image or other, and then go forth and create it in some way. Trying to work purely from an image in your head is a huge mistake, that’s not how it goes. What you see in your head is just the beginning, the initial idea.

quote

Quote:

Is it possible for art school to make someone who isn't naturally talented into a good artist?

There’s no such thing as natural talent. It’s all down to enthusiasm and endless practice. No one is born being able to draw perfect two point perspective studies, or being able to create complex 3d models on a PC. If you see someone that you consider to be hugely talented, I guarantee that they busted their balls in getting to where they are. Mr ‘brew hit the nail on the head with his last paragraph – “ 'skill' is ultimately hard work, trial and error, research, learning and pushing the envelope of what you're capable of”…

Some of that maybe sounds a bit harsh, but you gotta be as stubborn as fuck to get anywhere in the art world. But if you genuinely enjoy it, if it’s your dream, that won’t be a problem once you get to Uni/Art School. It’ll be a whole different kettle of fish to the college you’re at just now – and I mean that in the best way possible

[synj]

if you feel like its what you're supposed to do just keep doing it until something good happens. hell, it took me 2 years of solid trying to get a job i wanted.

[cybertoker2001]

I have a little saying.

"Anyone can be taught to draw, but you have to be born an artist."

Which basicly means that to be an artist (a true artist) you have to feel art, see art in everything, crave art with every fiber of your being. You can be taught to draw and it can be a fun little hobbie for you like fishing or riding a bike, but if you're to be an artist, you know it, feel it. There can be nothing else for you, only art.
That's just the way I see it. I hope you make the right decision.
Take it easy,
CT2001

[Gryphon]

I'd have to disagree. I, at least, wasn't born wanting to be an artist. I played around with it, but I never thought I'd do anything serious with it up until three years ago or so. Now I can't imagine doing anything else!

There is NO such thing as a true artist. There are only the people who history has chosen to acknowledge - many of the rest probably had just as much passion, just as much skill, but they weren't lucky enough to be remembered after they were dead.

The point being, (I have one, I swear!) Aratex, if it's your dream, run with it. The worst you can ever do is fail - and if that doesn't stop you, nothing can. Work through dry spells. Work through everything, and then when you get discouraged, look back at the work you've done six months ago. The difference will astound you.

[]Aratex[]

Thanks, everyone... You've all brought your own views to this, and that's what I want/need.. Keep 'em coming. :-)

In the meantime, though, I'd say that it's safe to say that, based on your advice, I'm going to keep working. As many of you have said already, art is too meaningful to just toss aside, and if I were to do that, I would regret it. The fact is that I've always had a deep love for all the arts, especially visual arts and music. I guess it just never crossed my mind until recently that I could spend my life doing one of those things that I love so much.

I'd love to stay and chat about how big of a decision you've helped me make, but I need to go find my sketch pad. :-) Thank you all... This won't be the last you hear from me.

[Yogi]

Hi there, as you may have noticed, I am new. On reading your topic I began to see similarities with my own attitude towards art. In a nutshell, I want to be a 3d, or 2d artist, but I too am in a rut. I understand how you may be discouraged, as I am too, but you have too really think about what you want. For me, I like art, videogames, music, etc.. I want to keep doing these things and enjoying them, even at work. I want to sleep in and not worry about getting fired, I want to wear whatever I want to work, and not give a crap. I want to have fun at my job, and not dread going to work every day, but look forward to it. I don't know if your goals are the same, but these are what keep me going. Remember, that you'll never be the best, just worry about bringing something unique to your workplace and you'll be fine. I too am young, and losing sleep about whether or not I'll ever be good enough. All I know is that you have to practice your @ss of and you'll do fine.

[VengerZap]

I spent a lot of my teens painting models and Gamesworkshop miniatures, star-ships, goblins, elves, aliens. I loved it, i found it really relaxing. Over the years I got better and better, until I was dam good at it and I began to seriously consider it as a carrer. I would have been quite happy spending my life doing something I loved and getting payed for it.

Then one day when I was about 16 my parent's sat me down and made me go through one of those stupid talks where your parents suddely have the need to interfer with your life.

I was asked what I would like to do with my life, I told them about my love of painting and art, and I would like to do something along those lines.

They said "no"

"Art isn't a proper job" My parents see art as a childist thing.

I pretty much stopped painted then and spent the next four years studing business studies before deciding I hated business studies and switched to computers (programming etc.) The world of computers isn't excally like that of art, but the programming does satisfy my creative side. And I consider it the best decision I ever made, even if my parents don't think so. Slowly I've drifted into computer related art as a hobby. I'm quite happy at the prospect of a life as a programmer, software engineer, web developer, systems analysit, or network administrator because I do enjoy that kind of stuff and I'll be sure of a steady income. But I've always wondered how my life would be if I'd been able to follow my first dream.

The moral of this story is, if you don't follow your dream your gonna spend the rest of your life wondering "what if..."

I have learned is much better to regret doing something than to regret not doing it.

But I would recommend you find some sort of back-up plan if the art stuff doesn't work out. Like a web designeer or what ever.

A friend of mine who was a fantastic artist decided at an early age to follow the art path, he spent 3 years at art college. When he finished, couldn't find a job and ended up joining the army as a grunt. 3 years of art college for nothing and a lifetime of works of art that will never be created.

[cybertoker2001]

Ok, I just want to clear somethin' up real quick. First off, I must totally disagree with Gryphon, on the topic of "real" artists, but I'm not going to go into that because that is not the subject of this thread. Basically, all I was trying to say to our buddy ]Aratex[ here, is that if this is what is right for him, if he is meant to be an artist, then he will know it. What can I say? It's a feeling that comes from your gut, you don't need us to tell you what to do or which path to take. If you've come to a "fork in the road" in your life, you have to make the ultimate decision on which way to go yourself.

Take it easy,
CT2001

[Quinnbeast]

Cybertoker, no one is suggesting that this isn't Aratex's decision to make. Without trying to be insulting, you're kinda missing the point. He's asking about other requirements, such as drawing ability and other skills. As he has stated, he's only just realised that his dream could in fact become a reality, so what better place to get advice than from people going down a similar path? You're spot on in saying that it's ultimately his choice, but he's doing the right thing by asking for some advice or for a few opinions of anyone willing to put in their 2pence/cents worth. It's called making an informed decision. Gut feeling is all well and good, but in this day and age, asking questions is just as important.

[mad]

i prefer to look at art as being dependent upon talent, as opposed to training. if you just don't have that natural ability, all the education, training, and practice in the world won't bring you up to par with those blessed with natural talent. you need to compare your work with those around you, factoring in experience, and see where you realistically stand.

with career decisions you have to be realistic above all. and remember, you don't need to be a successful professional artist to create inspired art.